Freedom isn't free.

Nine years ago, 2977 US lives were having their last day on this earth. Murdered by cowards who tried to gain by horrow what they couldn't gain by the sweat of their brow, these slain souls and shattered remnants serve as a reminder that the freedom we enjoy comes at a great price that must be paid continually with the blood of patriots But the tree of liberty will also be fed by the blood shed by tyrants as we fight back. Never forget.

EDIT: This was posted to remember someone close to me who died the eleventh. I posted on the tenth cause I like to remember him alive, remembering his last day alive instead of the way he had to leave. I'm sorry that some people on this board feel the need to attack, but also realize it would probably happen. I won't bother making argumentative or defensive posts at individual people though, as I have my beliefs and they have theirs. I just felt the need to express mine, and if they want to express theirs to a contrary belief, so be it.

By the way, anyone who feels patriotic about their country but also feels the government needs to make major changes, check out www.sons-of-liberty.net.

Huh

OK.

Excuse me, but right now it's the 10th september, not the 11th. :P

http://www.hupsilon.com/images/9_11_nevar_forget.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nissling

Excuse me, but right now it's the 10th september, not the 11th. :P

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I guess... HE FORGOT!

Does this mean the terrorists won?

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Originally Posted by NeoVamp

...
piece'o'shit
...




I guess... HE FORGOT!

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Who the hell would make such a pic that parodies the honoring of dead people? And why
the hell would you put such insanity on here? You do realize that this picture is insulting
the relatives of people who died without any effing reason on 9/11 by the hand of insane
terrorists?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by N.Saibot

Who the hell would make such a pic that parodies the honoring of dead people? And why
the hell would you put such insanity on here? You do realize that this picture is insulting
the relatives of people who died without any effing reason on 9/11 by the hand of insane
terrorists?

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Wake up! people have been dying since we first came to be,
over 60 million people died in World War II, and you don't see us making a MOCKERY of that drama.

because thats what America did when that tragedy struck, they made a mockery out of it.
with their NEVAR FORGET! WE FIGHT THEM THERE SO WE DONT HAVE TO FIGHTS THEM HERE!!
OMG AH WROTE A SONG ABOUT THE NINE ELEEEEVEN!!

A mockery.. so many deaths and the only way a country could grieve was by MTVing it..

Just an observation regarding that pic..I don't think Hulk Hogan is dead yet, unless I'm missing something :ok: ..


..

"Freedom isn't free, but this weekend at Uncle Nick's Fireworks Emporium, the fireworks are pretty damn close!"

It's not the 11th, so this isn't quite in bad taste yet.

Who gives a shit if a few people wrote songs about it? How does that mock everyone. Yeah the songs may have sucked balls but you act like a MTV exec urinated on the graves of all those people.

Why WWII? Yes 60 million died. No one debates the the significance of WWII. And guess what. They wrote songs about that too. I don't think Woody Guthrie singing about the Reuben James or Miss Pavlichenko ruins their memories. They wrote plenty of garbage back then too we have forgotten about just like the shit that was made after 9/11.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NeoVamp

Wake up! people have been dying since we first came to be,
over 60 million people died in World War II, and you don't see us making a MOCKERY of that drama.

because thats what America did when that tragedy struck, they made a mockery out of it.
with their NEVAR FORGET! WE FIGHT THEM THERE SO WE DONT HAVE TO FIGHTS THEM HERE!!
OMG AH WROTE A SONG ABOUT THE NINE ELEEEEVEN!!

A mockery.. so many deaths and the only way a country could grieve was by MTVing it..

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From where I stand that pic is same mockery you are talking about.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by N.Saibot

From where I stand that pic is same mockery you are talking about.

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Because thats what was accomplished, that a tragedy was turned into a mockery.

I mean.. how are people supposed to take this seriously when even the topic starter can't be bothered to :

a) Post it on the correct date.

b) Write a normal message that doesn't contain the word Liberty and the tyrants and the never forget and the whatnot.

The way America reacted to this tragedy paved the way for the world not really caring,
I mean.. why should the world care when even America can't be bothered?

I mean the world still cares, but remembering is done in a calm and respectable manner,
now had this thread been created with that intent then i would have aimed my post to the memory of those that lost their lives that day.

But to yet another misguided attempt at patriotism i can only respond like this.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ooXxXoo

Just an observation regarding that pic..I don't think Hulk Hogan is dead yet, unless I'm missing something :ok: ..

..

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But currently he is in the hospital with a severe case of OMFG MAH BACK HURTS!

which kinda counts... right?.... ...

While I disagree with NeoVamp on America making a mockery of the tragedy (the songs are goofy, and the lame tough-man rhetoric used by the TC are exceptions not the rule), I'm also saddened by how 9/11 has been exploited over the years. I'd like 9/11 to be a day of respectful remembrance for those who were lost, not a day in which we pledge to avenge the deaths by creating bloodshed oversees.

what is horrow?

i only want to kill the people that want to kill me is that so wrong?

And lets not forget the revival of McCarthyism

From a Euro standpoint i could not help and shake my head when i saw all the DO YOU HATE FREEDOM BOI? that has appeared in the media since that faithful day.

And while TV is perhaps not the greatest way of discovering the truth,
it does in a way manage to show current feelings.

And thats why I brought up McCarthyism, remember all the BETTER DEAD THEN RED! crap.
all these people were oppressed because they dared to believe differently,
and I'm not even debating the difference between Christianity/Islam or the difference between the West and the middle east,
I'm talking about the difference between people who used to go to school together.

and all this unnecessary patriotism does nothing but drive a wedge between people.

same with this thread, he makes it on the wrong day and full of patriotic slogans,
and the moment i dare say something about it I'm slapped around with the cliche OMG BUT PEOPLE DIED!

People always die, why is this suddenly worse then all the people who die
from Earthquakes, Flooding, Disease and war?

Everything on this world is one big political joke, who treat the population as puppets.

and thats why i refuse to shout slogans and wave the flag,
I'm a human being and my sorrow goes out to those who lost family and loved ones that day,
but not by waving the flag or wearing a novelty hat.

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Originally Posted by InternalPrimate

a day of respectful remembrance for those who were lost, not a day in which we pledge to avenge the deaths by creating bloodshed oversees.

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QFT

This has always been a sore spot for me. On one hand, I understand the tragedy that took place 9 years ago is something that all Americans should remember as an act of cowardice, perpetuated by half truths spouted forth by a tyrannical, religious zealot. On the other, you have the countless ABC specials, the Barbara Walters interviews with cousins of cousins of neighbors who used to know someone in the towers, Toby Keith and his inbred understanding of patriotism, etc., etc. In the end the hyper-sensationalism of 9/11 won out over the actual tragedy itself, and that's what we're left to deal with today. Unfortunately, because there are those that feel that the remembrance should be about the event itself, and not the events surrounding it, the topic has become somewhat of a flashpoint of contention, as seen above. I can't speak for NeoVamp, but I feel this whole uber-patriotic mindset is simply an extention of the media-created hype surrounding 9/11. I mean, can't we let sleeping dogs lie? How many people walk around talking about the attack on Pearl Harbor, or even the Oklahoma City bombings in the same sensationalist manner that they do for 9/11? Yes, it was a tragedy, but do we really need to bring it up every year that it rolls around?

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Originally Posted by bohokii

what is horrow?

i only want to kill the people that want to kill me is that so wrong?

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because fundamentally you shouldn't want to kill them, you should want them NOT to kill you.

Seriously though... it's been nine years. I agree that it was a horrible event, and that it was the worst terror attack in this generation... but isn't it time to move on?

Just as well you could say:

"On this day, 157 years ago, 100-140 lives of US citizens were lost. Murdered by cowards who tried to gain by horrow what they couldn't gain by the sweat of their brow, these slain souls and shattered remnants serve as a reminder that the freedom we enjoy comes at a great price that must be paid continually with the blood of patriots But the tree of liberty will also be fed by the blood shed by tyrants as we fight back. Never forget the Mountain Meadows Massacre, and never forgive those heathen Mormons!"

Sounds a bit silly now, doesn't it?

/ and just in case someone understands it wrong, no, I don't mean really mean that.

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Originally Posted by Phantar

Seriously though... it's been nine years. I agree that it was a horrible event, and that it was the worst terror attack in this generation... but isn't it time to move on?

Just as well you could say:

"On this day, 157 years ago, 100-140 lives of US citizens were lost. Murdered by cowards who tried to gain by horrow what they couldn't gain by the sweat of their brow, these slain souls and shattered remnants serve as a reminder that the freedom we enjoy comes at a great price that must be paid continually with the blood of patriots But the tree of liberty will also be fed by the blood shed by tyrants as we fight back. Never forget the Mountain Meadows Massacre, and never forgive those heathen Mormons!"

Sounds a bit silly now, doesn't it?

/ and just in case someone understands it wrong, no, I don't mean really mean that.

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More people should read history. Especially about the Crusades!

OP, I'm all for remembering 9/11 but could we do without all the jingoistic chest thumping crap? your post almost sounded like an excerpt from a GW Bush speech.

I immediately thought about the Yngwie Malmsteen song when I read the topic title. But I see there are a lot of things using the phrase.

I wonder what would happen if people realized freedom really was free?

NeoVamp is on the right track. It's always terrible when innocent people die, but the whole "them terrorists just do it cause they hate freedom!" is such a naive (and sadly widespread) viewpoint, and not even attempting to understand the motives isn't going to make the world a better place.

The link with McCarthyism and the red scare is accurate. The 9/11 attacks turned out to be very convenient for the neo-conservative movement as it filled the vacuum from the end of the cold war and gave them a new "global enemy". While still a very real danger, the threat of international terrorism has been overblown to a ridiculous degree (something the terrorist organizations love to exploit as well) to further their agendas, which is exactly what also happened in the cold war and the military capabilities of the Soviet Union. I remember seeing in the newspapers those large in-depth presentations of Al Qaeda's large bunkers in Afghanistan's mountains (which surprisingly still haven't been found, they sure must have hid them really well!).

Did the terrorists win? In the sense that they share mutual interests with the neo-conservatives in keeping the people frightened and submissive, I'd say they did.

9/11 was an inside job.



:|

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zebbe

I immediately thought about the Yngwie Malmsteen song when I read the topic title. But I see there are a lot of things using the phrase.

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I know freedom isn't free. That's why I pay taxes.

So yeah, I hate that phrase. It's like, if we lose the war, the Taliban will enslave us or force us to convert to Islam or take our land or something. I mean, what would honestly happen if we didn't go to war with Iraq? It's doubtful that there would be more terrorist attacks, especially as big as 9/11. What exactly would they be taking away from us? I dunno, it seems unclear to me.

And yeah, I think 9/11 should still be a day of recognition, but I think we should be over it by now. My friend told someone that we were going to a Soul Calibur tournament tomorrow and the guy was like, "what? That's awful, you can't have a tournament on 9/11!" and we were like, "well, what are you supposed to do on 9/11 then?" and he just stood there slackjawed. So wish me luck tomorrow, maybe I can beat some terrorists in a fighting game.

Why does everybody think that every Muslim is an extremist?

It's dumb how people wont' get over 9/11. Tons of other shit happened to us before but we're not crying about those now are we? We don't need a constant reminder for the next generation to deal with. There's plenty of evidence that 9/11 was set up anyways. Explain why that video shown on the news of a muslim lady was dancing around in joy was played. Media protrayed it as a celebration of attacking us. In reality, it was just someone celebrating their birthday. Many believe it was set up to make a reason for the US to go into war. Don't trust the media unless you research something thoroughly yourself. It could be an attack or a setup, take your pick.

I don't like people taking sides for anything. Hell, even in the US there's division just because we have mere borders. Sad and pathetic once you think about it. Screw patriotism, I'd rather just live a peaceful life amongst others.

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Originally Posted by arnold_the_bartender

It's dumb how people wont' get over 9/11. Tons of other shit happened to us before but we're not crying about those now are we? We don't need a constant reminder for the next generation to deal with. There's plenty of evidence that 9/11 was set up anyways Explain why that video shown on the news of a muslim lady was dancing around in joy was played. Media protrayed it as a celebration of attacking us. In reality, it was just someone celebrating their birthday. Many believe it was set up to make a reason for the US to go into war. Don't trust the media unless you research something thoroughly yourself.

I don't like people taking sides for anything. Hell, even in the US there's division just because we have mere borders. Sad and pathetic once you think about it. Screw patriotism, I'd rather just live a peaceful live amongst others.

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But then where would all these guys go:

http://image.sporttruck.com/f/293993...de+redneck.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/uRMf0.jpg

Since when has anything on this scale happened in the US? Yes we had Oklahoma, they tried to blow up the towers in the 90's and failed, Pearl Harbor etc. However none of them involved so many civilians. 2977 people died. Yes people have died throughout history. However lets look at the context. I think its a bit heartless or at least thoughtless to just say out a band-aid over and forget about it. Hell, Pearl Harbor Day was still fairly recognized when I was a kid.

Yeah Bush used it to his advantage, Patriot Act, Iraq, Afghanistan etc. The flag waving got old. Horrible music was made. But that does not take away from the tragedy. Sure we shouldn't sulk in it but Christ when was the last some people crashed and a couple jets in to some Skyscrapers. To me its still crazy to think about. If that annoys others oh well.

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Since when has anything on this scale happened in the US?

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1865-1877: Over 3000 Freedmen and their Republican Party allies were killed by a combination of the Ku Klux Klan and well-organized campaigns of violence by local whites in a campaign of terrorist violence which overthrew the reconstructionist governments in the American South and re-established segregation.

I don't want to think about how many Afghan and Iraqi civilians died in US airraids. More than 2977, that's for sure.

That took two years. Not a very good comparison. Tragic yes.

I think this has been proven:

Politics is something we simply shouldn't talk about on this forum. Wasn't TheEdge enough?

No he wasn't rational. He wouldn't take the time to actually listen to what anyone was saying and say something that might prove or disprove. No matter anyone would say to him they were always wrong and he was always right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Deo

Why does everybody think that every Muslim is an extremist?

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cause they are the only ones we see

I think it's ok to talk about as long as we're respectful of each others opinions. Now that theEdge is gone, I think that's a more obtainable goal.

I think it's time we all sat down and have a nice cup o' tea.

I feel;

9/11 has been abused by the media;

this has diminished the factor of the numerous deaths and the event itself;

9/11 had also been abused by the goverment as with anything exploited to gain a foot hold and too use to there advantage;

Ignorant people have been impregnated with this partriotic spouting shit, talking women who wear kitten jumpers to an office job, hicks, most grandma's ;)

said people have also failed to ask any serious questions and weigh up the significance for themselves and carry on chanting blind! AKA mob mentality.

simple fact is;

there were no heroes, there were no innocent but unfortunatly people who perhaps didn't deserve to die, did. as mentioned this is a way of life, I feel the way this has been blown way out of preportion has lessened the meaning of it all!

now it's a circus! people whos loved ones actually died are the ones who should mourn not millions of strangers who never even knew who there husband/wife/dad/mother/sister/daughter/brother/son and who could not possibly undestant the pain, but even they will move on, why shouldn't America.

Yes it is tragic, on the scale of things not it doesn't rate that high, we don't have remembrence days for Tsunamis in which was servere devestation, earthquakes or volcanoes.

Nobody dies for freedom, they died and it was taken away from you and I.