Soundchip Tribute

Quote:

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NOTES:

• PCM is a basic format for storing sound (the amplitude of the sound wave is recorded at a certain rate, each piece of the recording is a pulse)
• PWN is a different format for storing sound, based on storing widths of upwards and downwards shifts in the wave.
• DPCM/ADPCM are compressed forms of PCM, they store the changes between pulses instead of the pulses themselves.
• WSG means the chip uses small (usually 32 byte) PCM samples to form sound waves.
• FM means the chip can generate and combine sound waves based on a lot of parameters (like attack, decay, frequency, etc...)
• PSG means the chip has some standard waves it can play, and maybe some simple settings it can apply to them

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Sega Mega Drive / Genesis - YM2612 (FM) + SN76489 (PSG):
NOTE: Poor design decisions made the YM2612 on the MD weaker than it normally would be for PCM audio. Some slight changes and having a 4 channel mod player would be very doable on the Z80.

Capabilities:
6 Channel 4 Operator FM
3 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel Noise

Extra:
DAC mode - The last FM Channel can instead be used for 8bit PCM (5FM+1PCM).
Improved Noise mode - By sacrificing a Square Wave channel on the PSG chip the Noise can be greatly improved.

Tricks:
Software mixing for up to 4 PCM channels. Maximum quality is 26kHz.
Smooth PCM panning.
CSM mode - Timer A performs automatic key on/off for the third FM channel; can be used for speech synthesis.
Multi-Frequency mode - The third FM channel can be modified to have each operator run at a different frequency, allowing the use of extra voices.

Game Tracks

• Streets of Rage 2 - SOR Super Mix (Yuzo Koshiro)
• Vapor Trail - Main Theme (Hiroaki Yoshida, Tatsuya Kiuchi)
• Alien Soldier - Soldiers Song (Kazuo Hanzawa)
• Hybrid Front - Opening (Naofumi Hataya)
• Time Trax - Title Theme (Tim Follin)

Orchestral Tracks (Special MD only section because people are idiots)

• Gauntlet 4 - Adventures of Iron (Hitoshi Sakimoto)
• Master of Monsters - Into the Deep Blue Sky (Hayato Matsuo, Hitoshi Sakimoto)
• Castlevania Bloodlines - The Sinking Old Sanctuary (Michiru Yamane)
• Devilish - Seaside (Hitoshi Sakimoto)
• Verytex - Inner Lining of Planet (Hitoshi Sakimoto)

SNES Covers (Picked hard for FM tracks intentionally, with the exception of the last one to show the reverse)

MD Cover	SNES Original
Plok - Beach (Savaged Regime)	Plok - Beach (Tim Follin)
Chrono Trigger - Undersea Palace (Raijin)	Chrono Trigger - Undersea Palace (Yasunori Mitsuda, Nobuo Uematsu)
Secret of Mana - A Bell is Tolling (Alianger)	Secret of Mana - A Bell is Tolling (Hiroki Kikuta)
Super Castlevania 4 - The Submerged City (Gali)	Super Castlevania 4 - The Submerged City (Masanori Adachi, Taro Kudo)
Megaman X - Highway Intro Stage (Savaged Regime)	Megaman X - Highway Intro Stage (Setsuo Yamamoto)

Modern Chiptunes

• Infected Mushroom - Sa'eed (Savaged Regime)
• Dissipate (Tudd)
• Blast Processor - They Come From Above (Tony Leys)
• Sea Shore Shuffle (Dropbit, Robugga, Jredd)
• The Chaos Layer - Title Screen (Markey Jester)

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Super Nintendo Entertainment System - S-SMP ~ SPC700 (PCM):
NOTE: Very overrated. The best sure are great, but it usually sounds horribly muffled.

Capabilities:
8 Channel 16bit ADPCM (4bit compressed)
Limited to 64KB of RAM

Extra:
ADSR envelop control, Echo and Filtering.

Tricks:
It's possible to abuse the way the Echo is done to get 32 channels.
Dynamic instrument loading to bypass ram limit.

Plok - Beach (Tim Follin)
Flinstones - High Score (Keith Tinman, Jonathan Dunn)
Castlevania Dracula X - Bloodlines (Tomoya Tomita, Masanari Iwata, Harumi Ueko, Masahiko Kimura)
ActRaiser - Fillmore (Yuzo Koshiro)
Secret of Mana - The Dark Star (Hiroki Kikuta)
BONUS: Megaman & Bass - Museum (Toshihiko Horiyama, Naoshi Mizuta, Akari Kaida)

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NEC PC Engine / TurboGrafx-16 - HuC6280 (WSG) (also the CPU):
NOTE: No soundtrack back in the day used the PCM tricks. They don't take much CPU.

Capabilities:
6 Channel WSG

Extra:
LFO mode - FM style sound, uses the first two channels as one FM.
White Noise mode - can be turned on on channels 5 & 6.
DDA mode - 5bit PCM, can be used on any channel.

Tricks:
Channel Pairing for 10bit PCM.
Using the hblank interrupt for 15,7kHz PCM.
Software mixing for more channels.

Soldier Blade - Operation 6 (Keita Hoshi, Makiko Tanifuji)
Devil Crash - Main Stage (Toshiaki Sakoda)
Magical Chase - Stage 6 (Hitoshi Sakimoto, Masaharu Iwata)
Shockman - Stage 1 (Koji Hayama)
Blazing Lazers - Area 1 (Masatomo Miyamoto)
BONUS: 1943 - Original Stage 1 (?)
BONUS: Air Zonk - Brains Town (?)
BONUS: Coryoon - ? (?)
BONUS: Dragon Saber - Stage 1 (?)
BONUS: Legend of Xanadu 2 - Forest of Shudder (JDK Sound Team)

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SNK Neo Geo - YM2610 (FM+PCM+PSG):
NOTE: Most of the later soundtracks just streamed music from the cart. All songs here use FM too.

Capabilities:
4 Channel 4 Operator FM
3 Channel Square Wave
6 Channel ADPCM (fixed at 18.5kHz)
1 Channel ADPCM (variable sampling rate, 55kHz max)

Extra:
Low Frequency Oscillator.
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels)
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
Abusing the massive ROM space to store multiple instrument notes for MOD music.
Abusing the massive ROM space of the Neo Geo to stream entire soundtracks.

Super Dodge Ball - Misuzu Team Stage (Ida, Fumio Suzuki, Tadashi Takatsuka)
Zed Blade - Bionic Life (Manubu Namiki)
Viewpoint - Un Caillou Ricochet (Shizuyoshi Okamura)
Metal Slug X - Living on the Deck (Takushi Hiyamuta)
Ninja Masters - Staff Roll (Hiroaki Kujirai, Hiroaki Shimizu, Takeshi Muramatsu, Yuka Watanabe)
BONUS: Last Resort - Jack To The Metro (Toshio Shimizu, Yasuo Yamate)
BONUS: King of Fighters 99 - Tears (SNK Sound Team)
BONUS: Blazing Star - Apocalypse (?)

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Commodore Amiga - PAULA (PCM):
NOTE: Like anything involving Jay Miner, it's made to be abused.

Capabilities:
4 Channel 8bit PCM
Can use all RAM
Fixed Channel Panning

Extra:
All Channel Filter - Muffles the sound output (great for underwater sound).
Channel Pair Modulation - Similar to LFO.

Tricks:
Channel Pairing for 14bit PCM.
CPU driven feeding for up to 57kHz PCM.
Software mixing for up to 8 channels.

Stardust - Title (Risto Vuori, Bassbomb)
Alien Breed 2 - Theme (Allister Brimble)
Unreal - Title Theme (Reyn Ouwehand)
Pinball Fantasies - Intro (Olof Gustafsson)
SWIV - Intro (Andrew Barnabas)
Bonus: Risky Woods - Title Theme (José Martin)
Bonus: Turrican 3 - Main Theme (Chris Hülsbeck)

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Sharp X68000 - YM2151 (FM) + MSM6258 (PCM):
NOTE: Also used on Arcade boards.

Capabilities:
8 Channel 4 Operator FM
1 Channel ADPCM (Mono only)

Extra:
There was an addon with 8 PCM channels.

Tricks:
PCM playback on the FM channels.

* Battle Garegga - Fly to the Leaden Sky * (Manabu Namiki)
Neural Gear - Fluxtion (Keishi Yonao)
Star Trader - The Logic of Shooters (Yasuo Itoh, Keishi Yonao)
Illumination Laser - R.E.D (I.C.KaZe)
Bosconian - Blast Power (Yuzo Koshiro)
BONUS: Aquales - Blue Point (Hiroyuki Saegusa, Hiroshi Yamamoto)

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Sega Mega CD - RF5C164 (PCM):
NOTE: Rarely used by itself, also used on the FM Towns and Arcades

Capabilites:
8 Channel 8bit PCM
Limited to 64KB of RAM

Extra:
44.1kHz ADPCM for CDDA.

Tricks:
Dynamic instrument loading to bypass ram limit.

Sonic CD - Stardust Speedway Past (Naofumi Hataya, Masafumi Ogata)

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PC-98 - YM2608 (FM+PCM+PSG):
NOTE: The built in percussion samples are crap.

Capabilities:
6 Channel 4 Operator FM
3 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel 8bit ADPCM up to 16kHZ (4bit compressed)
6 Channel ADPCM with built in percussion samples

Extra:
Low Frequency Oscilator.
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels)
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
Unknown.

Grounseed - Demo (Ryu Umemoto, Masahiro Kajihara, Tatsuya Komoro, Daisuke Takahashi, Takahiro Nogi)
* Etrian Odyssey - Battlefield * (Yuzo Koshiro)
Touhou Kaikidan Mystic Square - The Grimoire of Alice (ZUN sound team)
Rusty - Water Gate (Masahiro Kajihara, Kenichi Arakawa, Ryu Takami)
Flame Zapper Kotsujin - Into the Last Battle (?) ----- NEEDS REPLACING

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Nintendo Entertainment System - RP2A03 (PSG) (also the CPU):
NOTE: Lots of games used addon soundchips on the cart, they only work on the Famicom.

Capabilities:
2 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel Triangle Wave (fixed volume)
1 Channel Noise
1 Channel 6bit DPCM (1bit compressed)

Extra:
Variable Duty Cycle, Pitch Bending.

Tricks:
Single Channel Echo.
Triangle Wave + Noise Drums.
DPCM Bass.
CPU driven feeding for 7bit PCM.

Silver Surfer - BGM 2 (Tim Follin)
Robocop 3 - Title (Jeroen Tel)
Journey to Silius - Underground Concourse (Nobuyuki Hara, Naoki Kodaka, About SS, Marumo, Mabochan)
Hero Quest - Theme (Neil Baldwin)
Darkman - Stage 3 (Jonathan Dunn)
BONUS: Doki! Doki! Yuuenchi - Space World (Nobuyuki Shioda)
BONUS: * Rihanna - Rude Boy * (TheFox)

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Sega Master System - SN76489 (PSG):
NOTE: It's pretty much garbage. Also used on the Game Gear, BBC Micro and ColecoVision

Capabilities:
3 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel Noise

Extra:
Improved Noise mode - By sacrificing a Square Wave channel the Noise can be greatly improved.

Tricks:
None.

* Sonic Chaos - Final Gear Zone * (Chris Kelly)
Alien 3 - Main Theme (Matt Furniss)
The Flash - Title Screen (Jeroen Tel)
Master of Darkness - Thames River (Fumie Kumatani, Yoko Wada)
GG Shinobi 2 - Factory 1 (Yuzo Koshiro)
BONUS: Quartet - Theme (Katsuhiro Hayashi)

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Commodore 64 - SID (PSG):
NOTE: Can barely be called a PSG chip, this thing's a monster.

Capabilities:
3 Channel Square/Triangle/Sawtooth/Noise Wave

Extra:
ADSR envelopes, Filter, Ring Modulators.

Tricks:
Fake 4th channel 4bit PCM (abuses a volume register bug on the first revision).
Fake 4th channel echo (abuses a volume register bug on the first revision).

* Metal Warrior 4 - Track 3 * (Lasse Oorni)
Robocop 3 - Title (Jeroen Tel)
Last Ninja 2 - Central Park (Matt Gray)
Turrican - Ending (Chris Hülsbeck, Ramiro Vaca, Stefan Hartwig)
Gauntlet 3 - Character Select (Tim Follin)

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MSX with MSX-Music - YM2413 (FM) + AY-3-8910 (PSG):
NOTE: The FM chip was also used on the Sega Mark III.

Capabilities:
1 Channel 2 Operator FM
8 Channel 2 Operator FM (built-in instruments)
3 Channel Square Wave

Extra:
Drum mode: -3 FM channels -> 5 Channel "FM Drums" (built-in instruments).
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels).
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
PCM by using the volume registers on the PSG chip.

Illusion City - The One Who Rules the Heavens (Tadahiro Nitta, Yukiharu Urita, Yasufumi Fukuda)
* Bombaman - The Boggy Marches (Jorrith Shaap) * !!! NOT AVAILABLE ON YOUTUBE !!!
Final Fantasy - Battle Scene (Nobuo Uematsu, Tadahiro Nitta)
Aleste 2 - Title Theme (Toshiaki Sakoda)
Dragon Slayer 6 - Ending (Mieko Ishikawa)

MSX with Konami SCC - SCC (WSG) + AY-3-8910 (PSG):
NOTE: The PSG was typically used to make drums.

Capabilities:
5 Channel WSG (channels 4 & 5 share the same instrument)
3 Channel Square Wave

Extra:
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels).
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
PCM by using the volume registers on the PSG chip.

Metal Gear 2 - Zanzibar Breeze (Masahiro Ikariko, Kazuhiko Uehara, Izumi Mutsuhiko)
Snatcher - Bio Hazard (Masahiro Ikariko)
Space Manbow - Memories (Kazuhiko Uehara, Tsuyoshi Sekito, Y. Manno)
Salamander - Prologue (Masahiro Ikariko, Motoaki Furukawa)
Nemesis III - Feel Pleasure To The Death (Kazuhiko Uehara, Motoaki Furukawa, Michiru Yamane, Yukie Morimoto)

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ZX Spectrum - Beeper (Beeper):
NOTE: Music is produced by rapidly changing the on/off setting in the beeper

Capabilities:
*BEEEEP*... that's it.

Extra:
Nothing.

Tricks:
Any and all music is a trick.

Chronos - Title (Tim Follin)
The Light Corridor - Main Theme (Alberto Gonzalez)
* Future Looter - Title * (Mr Beeper)
Dark Fusion - Title (Ben Daglish)
Hyperactive - Title (Keith Tinman)

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Nintendo GameBoy - LR35902 (PSG) (also the CPU):
NOTE: It was rather underused.

Capabilities:
2 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel Noise
1 Channel 4bit PCM (stores 64 values in memory)

Extra:
Variable Duty Cycle.

Tricks:
Abusing the 4th channel for proper PCM.

Project S11 - Ekans Desert (Aleksi Eeben)
Marvin Strikes Back - Title (Alberto Jose Gonzalez)
Xerd no Densetsu II - Welcome to Town (Yoko Suzuki, Fumito Tamayama)
Lufia The Legend Returns - Sinistral Battle (Yasunori Shiono)
Castlevania Belmont's Revenge - Praying Hands (Hidehiro Funauchi)

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Nintendo Gameboy Advance - DirectSound (PCM) + LR35902 (PSG):
NOTE: A lot of soundtracks only use DirectSound, like all of the songs on this list.

Capabilities:
2 Channel 8bit PCM
2 Channel Square Wave
1 Channel Noise
1 Channel 4bit PCM (stores 64 values in memory)

Extra:
Nothing

Tricks:
Software mixing for extra PCM channels.

Golden Sun - Venus Lighthouse (Motoi Sakuraba)
Metroid Fusion - Sector 1 (Minako Hamano, Akira Fujiwara)
Donkey Kong Country 3 - Stilt Village (Dave Wise)
F-Zero Climax - Mute City (Yumiko Kanki, Kenji Hikita)
Fire Emblem - Together We Ride (Yuka Tsujiyoko)

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Atari Lynx - 65SC02 (PSG) (also the CPU):
NOTE: I'm not completly up to par with it's capabilities...

Capabilities:
4 Channel Polynomial Sequence Generated Waves (From Square to Noise)

Extra:
DAC mode on every channel for 8bit PCM.

Tricks:
Unknown.

Klax - Title Screen (Brad Fuller, ?)
Qix - Title Screen (?)
Zarlor Mercenary - Theme (?) !!! NOT AVAILABLE ON YOUTUBE !!!
Bill & Teds Excellent Adventure - Theme (?)
Electrocop - In-Game (?)

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Bandai Wonderswan - Unknown (WSG):
Note: I'm not completly up to par with it's capabilities...

Capabilities:
4 Channel 4bit WSG

Extra:
Channel 2 can be 8bit PCM.
Channel 3 can have a sweep effect.
Channel 4 can do Noise.

Tricks:
Unknown.

Rockman EXE N1 Battle - Battle Theme (Yosuke Beppu)
Riviera - Tetyth The Underwater City - (Minako Adachi, Shigeki Hayash)
Megaman & Bass - Museum
Start Hearts - First Dungeon Theme (?) !!! NOT AVAILABLE ON YOUTUBE !!!
Makai Toushi Saga - Demon Cave (Nobuo Uematsu)

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ZX Spectrum 128k - AY-3-8910 / YM2149 (PSG):
NOTE: Also used on the Amstrad CPC, MSX and Atari ST

Capabilities:
3 Channel Square Wave

Extra:
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels).
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
PCM by using the volume registers on the PSG chip.

* YM Rockerz - Junkie 2149 * (Timbral)
* Lethal Xcess - Title Music * (Jochen Hippel)
LED Storm - Title (Tim Follin)
Stormlord 2 - Title (Dave Rogers)
The Light Corridor - Title (Alberto Gonzales)

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Atari 800/5200 - POKEY (PSG):
NOTE: This chip detunes a lot due to only having 8bit frequency control

Capabilities:
4 Channel Square Wave/Noise

Extra:
Channel Pairing for 16bit frequency control.
Variable Duty Cycle.
Distortion Effect.

Tricks:
PCM by rapidly changing the volume register.
Sawtooth wave, triangle wave, clarinet and electric guitar instruments using undocumented features.

* World of Wonders - Atari Fever * (Claas Clever)
Hivmania - Ingame (Bartosz Kalinowski)
Lemmings - Intro (Fred Brooker)
Bitter Reality - Dragon Bobs (Torsten Karwoth)
Draconus - Theme (Adam Gilmore)

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PC with Adlib/Soundblaster - YM3812 (FM):
NOTE: Most games used midi instead of programming the chip directly (and sounded like crap)

Capabilities:
9 Channel 2 Operator FM

Extra:
Midi playback.
Drum mode: -3 FM channels -> 5 Channel "FM Drums" (built-in instruments).

Tricks:
None.

Tyrian - Space Journey 2 (Alexander Brandon)
Theme Hospital - 6's and 7's (Jeremy Longley, Adrian Moore, Russell Shaw, Andy Wood)
Descent - Main Theme (Tim Wiles)
Dig it! - Tune 5 (?)
Wacky Wheels - Dream (Mark Klem)

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NEC PC-8801 - YM2203 (FM+PSG):
NOTE: Don't know much about it, it was later replaced by the YM2608

Capabilities:
3 Channel 4 Operator FM
3 Channel Square Wave

Extra:
ADSR envelope control for the PSG (same for all the selected channels).
Noise Mode for any PSG channel.

Tricks:
PCM by using the volume registers on the PSG chip.

YS 1&2 - Palace of Destruction (JDK Sound Team)

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Todo:
Reorder chips.
Add more music to the Atari-ST and PC-88 (maybe replace the ST with the spectrum... much easier)

MSX2-K051649(AY-3-8910+5 channels of wavetable synth)


PC98-YM2608(OPNA)

Sweet :D

The PC-98 with the speakboard and the X68000 are my favorite computer chips.I am planning to upload some soundtracks on youtube from Yu-No for the PC98.It's really good stuff.

Manabu Namiki is keeping the old style going.

YM2151+OKI6295-some of the most impressive stuff on the YM2151-from 1996


He made these last year, though I don't know what chip he used, but i know it's FM.

New Messiah


Load BGM


everyone should know these two

Alien's Den


The Foggy Cave In The Darkness

That YM2608 tune you posted sounds amazing after the 1 minute mark
The metal gear tune is also excellent, I'm almost ashamed for forgetting to put those 2 soundchips. Thankyou for finishing the job :)

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

That YM2608 tune you posted sounds amazing after the 1 minute mark
The metal gear tune is also excellent, I'm almost ashamed for forgetting to put those 2 soundchips. Thankyou for finishing the job :)

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That ryu umemoto's style, I hope to upload the soundtrack one of these days.He's really good at programming FM, he posts on soundshock.se once in a while.It's his music that got me interested in old japanese PCs.Here's an interview with him.http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/umemoto/umemoto.htm

You forgot POKEY:

That Metal Slug 4 song is not played on the Neo Geo hardware. The ingame version is mono and quite a few khz lower. It was one of the first Neo Geo titles made by Playmore after the original SNK folded, I suspect they used low quality sampled music due to lack of experience with FM programming.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GeckoYamori

The ingame version is mono and quite a few khz lower.

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I know but it sounds almost the same, I couldn't find the true neo geo version on youtube.

Are you giving tribute to the characteristic an classic sounds of the chips? Or how they can be pushed to the limits?

For stock NES (no additional sound hardware), I thought this was one of the more impressive tunes on it:

Quote:

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MSX2-K051649(AY-3-8910+5 channels of wavetable synth)

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PCE's audio chip is just an upgraded version of that SCC chip. Suspiciously strange as neither are officially linked by any developers or such, that I know of. Even more strange, the hidden noise channel modes discovered later on for this chip (for both channel 5 and 6) and never officially described or used, are there exactly and officially on the PCE's version (channel 5 and 6). Both came out in the same year too. On that note, someone needs to come up with a name for the PCE's audio chip, instead of just 6280 (which is the cpu name). PCFX has the same chip, minus the cpu part, and labels it "SoundBox". /nitpick_on Wavetable is the wrong name for the description of the SCC chip. It's sample based synth. Or better put, since the waveforms are tiny: DDS (Direct Digital Synthesis) sans the PHA (uses period divide instead of phase accumulator, but that's just a matter of the method of precision and scaling the frequency). /nitpick_off :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Blammo

You forgot POKEY:

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Hehehe, not really, I'm not a big fan of POKEY.
You know what's sad though? I like it more than the YM2149F used on the Atari-ST. If anyone knows of any game that uses the STE's extra pcm channels available on youtube please add it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomaitheous

Are you giving tribute to the characteristic an classic sounds of the chips? Or how they can be pushed to the limits?

For stock NES (no additional sound hardware), I thought this was one of the more impressive tunes on it:

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Classic sound in the sense that the music was used in games, no demo tunes or anything.

If I went by demo tunes Paula would dominate by a large margin :).

Btw if you know of any nes game with comparable quality (without extra chips) to that music above, please post it.

What game is that SNES chip song from? It actually sounds good, almost like dance music.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zetastrike

What game is that SNES chip song from? It actually sounds good, almost like dance music.

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It's from Plok.The music was done by the Follin brothers.They're good at using a chip to it's potential.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by zetastrike

What game is that SNES chip song from? It actually sounds good, almost like dance music.

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This fun little game (Not that great, but fun). The music is just amazing although the one I posted is by far the best. Tim Follin really knew how to use the SNES soundchip, Rock'N'Roll racing is another good example of his skill:



But really, he knew how to use ANY soundchip, here's him on the mega drive (game's unreleased, and this was recorded of a crappy model 2):

Another Follin classic.

Funny how this went from a SoundChip appreciation thread to a Tim Follin appreciation thread.

Even more funny is how that's not surprising at all ;)

Awesome threads lately :-) The Commodore 64's SID chip is one that gets a lot of attention. I like it except for the trilly sound that's used so much to get around the limited voices (I guess). Have to admit, I can't stand the Giana Sisters' theme, though...gets under my skin for some reason.

I don't have any good links off the top of my head...I bet there are some C64 fans here, though :-)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

Funny how this went from a SoundChip appreciation thread to a Tim Follin appreciation thread.

Even more funny is how that's not surprising at all ;)

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He's really good ,too bad he left the industry.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Yoder

Awesome threads lately :-) The Commodore 64's SID chip is one that gets a lot of attention. I like it except for the trilly sound that's used so much to get around the limited voices (I guess). Have to admit, I can't stand the Giana Sisters' theme, though...gets under my skin for some reason.

I don't have any good links off the top of my head...I bet there are some C64 fans here, though :-)

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Last Ninja 2-Matt Gray

How about some emotional themes now:

YM2612:


SPC700(S-SMP):


HuC6280(SoundBox):


YM2151:


Paula:


Direct Sound A and B?:


Need one for the YM2610 :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tomaitheous

Are you giving tribute to the characteristic an classic sounds of the chips? Or how they can be pushed to the limits?

For stock NES (no additional sound hardware), I thought this was one of the more impressive tunes on it:




PCE's audio chip is just an upgraded version of that SCC chip. Suspiciously strange as neither are officially linked by any developers or such, that I know of. Even more strange, the hidden noise channel modes discovered later on for this chip (for both channel 5 and 6) and never officially described or used, are there exactly and officially on the PCE's version (channel 5 and 6). Both came out in the same year too. On that note, someone needs to come up with a name for the PCE's audio chip, instead of just 6280 (which is the cpu name). PCFX has the same chip, minus the cpu part, and labels it "SoundBox". /nitpick_on Wavetable is the wrong name for the description of the SCC chip. It's sample based synth. Or better put, since the waveforms are tiny: DDS (Direct Digital Synthesis) sans the PHA (uses period divide instead of phase accumulator, but that's just a matter of the method of precision and scaling the frequency). /nitpick_off :)

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I'd hit that tune like Charlie Brown

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

Paula:

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According to the video description, that's a MIDI remake. The original, I think, is here:

Thanks Blammo

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

How about some emotional themes now:

Need one for the YM2610 :P

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Metal Black-Born to Be Free

A little too... Happy. Very nice tune though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

A little too... Happy. Very nice tune though.

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Really, I find the song kind of sad, it's for the first level, where you fly over a destroyed city.

Where is the redbook audio tribute....ill post a lot in that thread.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Curryman123

Where is the redbook audio tribute....ill post a lot in that thread.

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Go ahead and make one.Redbook isn't made on the chip, in my opinion it's more impressive to make music on a chip, especially where programming is needed.

Here's another sound chip to add the list: the Yamaha YM3812.

Song courtesy of Zero Wing(it was recorded off a SoundBlaster Pro 2.0 with a Yamaha YMF262, but the YMF262 is backwards-compatible with the YM3812, so the sound is the same regardless of which chip is used):



And more from the YM2151 courtesy of Salamander and Life Force:

Power of Anger:



Poison of Snake:



Destroy Them All:



Thunderbolt:



First two were ripped from Salamander Deluxe Pack Plus for the PlayStation and the last two were recorded using a modified version of MAME's emulated YM2151.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

This list features no shitty generic PSG chips like those found on the amstrad cpc or the Atari ST, screw them and their uninteresting music.

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Hmm...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iR3Cc5erCuE


And if you're going to include a CPU driven PWM title demo tune on the beeper . . .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4Uy69Jjk9M
(YM2149 MOD Atari ST Turrican II intro ;))
(plenty of other examples of that)

There's even more demos after the fact and the 3 channel Spectrum sample tracker.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

Hehehe, not really, I'm not a big fan of POKEY.
You know what's sad though? I like it more than the YM2149F used on the Atari-ST. If anyone knows of any game that uses the STE's extra pcm channels available on youtube please add it.

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You don't like the AY/YM or POKEY in games, or demos?

POKEY didn't get a real chance due to the lack of supported as such in the long term. (ie no PCM, no PWM, etc in commercial games in spite of the nice built-in timers and 4-bit linear volume modulation ;))

Adlib got lots of support, but was used poorly far too often, and soundblaster never (or almost never) used the PCM channel to supplement FM in music. (a few games pushed MOD without FM, but that's a bit of a waste)
Few games pushed the OPL3 either, and none to its full potential, and that's what homebrew and demos are for. ;)
http://battleofthebits.org/barracks/Profile/madbrain/
(there's a better profile on 8bc, but that's down it seems)

And if you want to include homebrew game music, that's another story too, especially for POKEY.

At least there's some pretty nice ST/Speccy/CPC tunes from European games. (Turrican II even pushed in-game PCM percussion in a few cases)

Though I don't think any game pushed it like this:
http://battleofthebits.org/arena/Entry/Polaracer/3617/
(doesn't seem to be using any PWM effects either, though that's certainly something that far too few games took advantage of, or more so the envelope channel hack -and that's not CPU intensive either, unlike PCM or PWM)

Turrican II has some pretty nice arrangements though, I'm not sure what the "best" example of classic AY/YM PSG music would be though. (but I'm sure it would kick the crap out of the best SN76489 stuff ;))
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmI2XZ0PBzQ

For the stock NES, Top Gun 2nd Mission is pretty awesome:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7tDV2pxRz8


And with Codemasters you got a style rarely seen on the NES . . . makes it sound like a C64 ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8ruaLiGfkA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oiTSG6u0fmE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxcY0G7Ha0Y (see the high score theme at 5:00)

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

Hehehe, not really, I'm not a big fan of POKEY.
You know what's sad though? I like it more than the YM2149F used on the Atari-ST. If anyone knows of any game that uses the STE's extra pcm channels available on youtube please add it.

Classic sound in the sense that the music was used in games, no demo tunes or anything.

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Officially released homebrew games included or just "classic" games?


Oh, and does the MT-32/LAPC-I count?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-XLZbvFEhI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qm6spY_O9bM


http://www.yvan256.net/soundcards/sa...r_-_LAPC-1.mp3

Not sure what the Gameboy chip is called, but it can pump out some awesome stuff.I used to listen to these when i first got my GBC.

Turok 2(GBC)-Alberto Gonzalez






Here's some stuff from his NES days, you can here some C64 influence there again.



Here's a video some of his various works through the years


He's very good, but I haven't heard anything from him in years.

The gameboy chip is the last one on my list kokujin ;)

And by classic I really meant in games of the time, no demos or recent homebrews. Still if anyone wants to make a "Sounchips pulled to their limits" I'd be glad to contribute.

Software driven PCM tunes isn't really what I would call a good example of the classic sound of the chip kool kitty. I put in the beeper as a joke :P, and the gba... well the gba soundchip is just 2 PCM channels to write into.

And the ghouls and ghosts theme on the atari-st is made by Tim Follin, that guy can make ANY chip sound good.
Here's the amiga version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK4osO00-js
I mean.. really...

"Oh, and does the MT-32/LAPC-I count?"
That's the midi thing that makes games sound good right? Don't know much about it but it sure sounds nice.

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

The gameboy chip is the last one on my list kokujin ;)

And by classic I really meant in games of the time, no demos or recent homebrews. Still if anyone wants to make a "Sounchips pulled to their limits" I'd be glad to contribute.

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I didn't see the gameboy post, I also didn't post anything that wasn't from an actual game.I think we should keep the thread for actual game music and not demos.

That line was for kool kitty, i should have put a quote or @koolkitty in that post somewhere, sorry for the confusion kokujin

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

Software driven PCM tunes isn't really what I would call a good example of the classic sound of the chip kool kitty. I put in the beeper as a joke :P, and the gba... well the gba soundchip is just 2 PCM channels to write into.

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Yes, but where's the limit between "pure" chip-synth and software synth?
How about CPU driven envelopes, PWM (be it interrupt or cycle timed), or PCM effects? (especially those used in-game -Stormlord has PCM on in-game in-game on the C64, as does Turrican on the ST)
Should we discount all YM2612 music using software PCM/ADPCM/MOD playback through the DAC channel? (or PCM on the TG-16)

What about DSP/CPU driven sample sound systems: they may not be hacks like PSG or bare DACs for PCM, but they're still technically similar. (and you've got a range from simple DMA audio with a coprocessor -or main CPU/shared coprocessor as in the N64/32x/GBA/etc- that drives the audio, the SNES's sound system would fall into that category too)
Hell, Paula is more CPU reliant than many later sample based systems, and without CPU work, you'd have no looped samples or such. (of course, you need a CPU/MCD in all cases to update the sound registers on even the simplest PSG)

Where is the line drawn?


And the GBA's sound hardware is nearly identical to the 32x's, PWM with the same odd formatting iirc (allowing variable resolution and sample rate trade-offs) with DMA driven stereo. (ie hardwired left and right channels, like the STe, or 1/2 the Amiga; though if you feed it through mono output, it could be treated as 2 channels without the annoying problems of hard L/R instruments -there's a mono mode on the digital end, but that's a single-channel mode)

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And the ghouls and ghosts theme on the atari-st is made by Tim Follin, that guy can make ANY chip sound good.
Here's the amiga version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eK4osO00-js
I mean.. really...

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I know that, though there's some other kick-ass musicians out there too, though they left the scene before Follin. (like Galway and Hubbard)
Follin gets a lot of attention, but there's quite a few others out there who pushed things too.

I like the ST/CPC/Speccy versions of the Ghouls n' Ghosts music a fair bit more than the C64 or Amiga tunes in a few cases. (happens with several other games too)

That and the fact that they butchered the arcade soundtrack rather than arranging/remixing things to cater to the platform (with a handful of exceptions where arranged/remixed tracks were used). Far too many European arcade ports did that unfortunately. (same for that stupid SFX OR Music option many games forced rather than offering the more sensible middle ground with SFX AND Music -cutting out the least significant instruments to play SFX, the option would have been nice if they'd given SFX+Music instead of just FX, or all 3 -rather ironic that some games using beeper only forced music+FX on such limited hardware or the same for the PC Speaker where plain FX -or plain music in a few cases where single voice square wave was OK- would have been very useful)
Just because the music is good, doesn't mean it's a good idea to replace the real game music. (other than added intro/title music perhaps, like R-Type, though that's not remotely fitting tot he game either)

Of course, with all else equal, Paula will sound better, but that's not the point: the point is getting good use out of something and enjoying it for what it is.

The AY/YM PSG is pretty good for the time (1979 or earlier) with advantages over POKEY and universal superiority over the cheap SN76489 (weaker noise generation, low pitch resolution, no ADSR, etc -also worse for PCM hacks due to the coarser steps both for doing 4-bit log samples and 2/3 channel higher res hacks -in which case you could take advantage of the 5-bit logarithmic res per channel).
The advantages over POKEY, of course, are the dynamic pitch range and hardware envelope (which can also be hacked for a low-res saw/triangle wave for a total of 4 channels plus noise), that and better PCM hacks for some things. (added channels can produce 8-bit or higher approximated resolution, but POKEY has superior single channels with 4-bit linear range much preferable to the logarithmic channels in that context -plus 3 timers to allow interrupt driven effects)

Cases where the AY sounds like the SN, is underutilization of the chip, and even Follin couldn't make the SN sound like the AY does above. (or various chip demo artists for that matter)
The SN is like the worst characteristics of POKEY and the AY8910 rolled into one, though also in a very small package. ;) (the other 2 both had I/O functionality crammed into them too)
Even TIA is ahead of the SN in some areas, albeit it's pretty crap for anything but exremely stylized music due to the low pitch resolution (short of PWM), though it can also do things that the AY can't (like the periodic pulse wave noise so characteristically "Atari")

They're all ~1979 chips too, and the AY remained the absolute best single sound chip on the open market until Yamaha's FM synth chips arrived in 1985. (and among those first couple chips produced was the fully YM2149 compatible YM2203 -including the I/O, though requiring an external DAC and I think only supporting mono)
It's a shame that there weren't better alternatives in-between though. (General Instruments later came out with the AY-2-8930 with variable pulse width and 3 envelopes, but I think that wasn't until the late 80s -and by that point the YM2203 should have been a more interesting upgrade anyway, a shame the STe didn't add that ;) -albeit they could have been putting that on higher end STs from 1986 onward at least ;))

Just be glad that, if they had to choose off the shelf, that the MSX/CPC/128k/ST opted for the AY/YM PSG and not the weak SN. ;) (a shame the Colecovision and SMS did that -especially as both should have been able to pus the I/O ports to good use)
That also should have been the chip of choice for early PC sound cards (and was for the Apple Mockingboard), but oddly there were no soundboards for the PC (professional or consumer) until 1987 with the Adlib followed by the MT32, Gameblaster, and others in '89 onward. (the PCJr/Tandy-1000 used the SN PSG unfortunately, though actually got some good use out of it -Thexder sounds better than the MSX version, albeit in part due to SFX being on the PC speaker channel and the MSX game not optmizing things)


We've discussed some of this before:
http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12564
Let alone several other chiptune threads. ;)

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"Oh, and does the MT-32/LAPC-I count?"
That's the midi thing that makes games sound good right? Don't know much about it but it sure sounds nice.

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It's a complex hardware synthesizer combining additive, subtractive, and sample sysnthesis along with some other features. (samples are hardcoded and limited to attack and percussion, the rest is done with simple waveforms) There's also hardware reverb.

Roland dropped it in favor of Geneeral Midi at the biginning of the 90s, and it never got a lower-cost consumer-oriented consolidated design, unfortunately, and thus faded from the scene in favor of sample based stuff. (all it needed was soundblaster compatible DMA sound -since it lacked any sort of native imported sample playback- and a consolidated chipset, and it probably could have become a major player on the mass market -it had been around since '87, so by the early 90s the potential for consolidation was pretty high)



Another one not mentioned is the YM2203 prominent on the older and lower-end PC8801s (maybe PC9800 series as well).


That and some Ensoniq chips (true wavetable synth -and sample synth/PCM streaming capabilities I believe), though the Apple II was the only computer/game console to have that standard. (some arcade games used Ensoniq synths though)






Edit:
but on the YM2203, and also in for contrast with the MT-32 tracks, you've got:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eADSS9FgNxA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-y6jW-JaPo

(I think SSG/PSG is limited to SFX)

You're looking WAY too much into this... What part of "classic chip sound" is hard to get :p? Stuff that sounds good but doesn't go out of it's way to do things the chip wasn't supposed to.

- Making the AY chip do the turrican intro - Not what the chip sounds like at all normally.
- Programming the 32X or GBA sounds channels to make music - It's what they're supposed to do.

See the difference?

I'd like a tune for the Atari-ST using the extra PCM channels because drums are a huge part of music for me, same reason I'm pissed off at how underused they were for the pc engine chip. It's either awesome effects like in blood gear or xanadu, or good drums like in shockman, rarely both (there's soldier blade and a few others).

The beeper is there as a joke, really other than that crazy music by Follin and a few others it's... well... a beeper.

And there's a reason the SN76489 is only on the list as a helper to the YM2612 ;)
Also the jerk comment about putting it on the Master System.
SN76489 Alone = Crap.

If you want to make a thread about pushing the chips, I have some demo tunes for the amiga I'd love to post :), and that awesome song by Follin for the MD would fit the bill perfectly too.

Time Trax is amazing...and its funny when I heard Rock And Roll racing, I thought of the Spiderman and X-men soundtrack then scrolled down to see it was the same guy :)

Some of my favorites-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0Mp8uMammw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qH9F...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wWHZE14hP8

I added a few things to the post above too. ;)

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Originally Posted by Kamahl

You're looking WAY too much into this... What part of "classic chip sound" is hard to get :p? Stuff that sounds good but doesn't go out of it's way to do things the chip wasn't supposed to.

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But that's just is: who defines what the chip is "supposed" to do?
When they added the timers to POKEY, were they thinking of CPU assisted sound tricks or mainly for use with SIO and such?

How about the bug in SID used for PCM without sacrificing a hardware channel for volume modulation? (should all such cases be discounted, or all cases of PSG/volume modulation PCM, or PWM?)
Or using the AY's envelope as a saw/triangle wave channel?
Software envelopes?
etc, etc

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- Making the AY chip do the turrican intro - Not what the chip sounds like at all normally.
- Programming the 32X or GBA sounds channels to make music - It's what they're supposed to do.

See the difference?

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Yep, and that's the difference between using the "chip" and using the computer behind it:

Again, where do you draw the line with CPU assistance?

This has come up before and there's never, ever been anything conclusive resulting from it. :p

If you include CPU-intensive PCM on the YM2612, where else do you allow it? Do you discount all games using CPU driven PWM, PCM, envelope, etc effects?
Limit CPU to ONLY providing register updates and sample loop times (for DMA audio)?

So what, compare the chips on the basis on what could have been done using only a super slow/weak CPU/MCU? (like in the kHz range depending on the chip -650x/680x has dramatically faster instructions than some others, maybe a 500 kHz 8008 ;))


And if the YM2612's DAC is fair game, why not similar hacks on PSGs?
Even with such a double standard, you'd need to eliminate Afterburner II from the Genesis sound too since it's doing all PCM via the PSG. :p (software mixing to 2 channels at that -probably interleaving)

For any games that did software mixed MOD on the Mac or STe, should that be discounted too? (since it requires mixing, or at least scaling for notes unless you did fixed rate playback -or limited it to the preset STe rates)

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I'd like a tune for the Atari-ST using the extra PCM channels because drums are a huge part of music for me

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You must love what Tiido's doen on the MD then. ;) (or what a handful of developers did back then, like with Vapor Trial and Atomic Runner -Galaxy Force II has some pretty decent percussion too)

And again, there ARE in-game examples of PCM percussion for the ST, as with Turrican II. (rather low quality, of course, and actually sounds a little weaker than the PSG samples on Afterburner II in spite of that PSG being weaker for such -and apparently it's not hacking 3 channels for higher res approximation either, just 4-bit log samples at 3 kHz -and as such ABII sounds damn good considering, maybe they just managed some really good preprocessing/formatting catering to the PSG) OTOH it sounds better than some DAC PCM playback on the MD, as does ABII. ;) (a shame that that's the case, but there's some pretty poor software PCM playback through the DAC)

Anyway, for Turrican II, see:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9cmiW42oXg

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azCJeaLD6AE

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TeDIeTWF13o

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUsWxCH0Qz8

(nice reverb in the last one -not sure there's any PCM in that one though)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7bntCzEsQM
(not as thick as the NES's PCM bass Tom posted earlier, but still has a nice kick to it)

I'll stop there as I might end up posting the entire game otherwise, so:
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...0812A437B10E1C


Plenty of other games that did PCM SFX in-game, but usually concurrently (not simultaneously) with Music, and rarely used in the music itself.
Turrican II is the opposite: does all SFX with PSG sounds (seems like it uses PWM definitely the sawtooth hack channel for some FX too) and concurrent use of channels for FX/PCM/music. (not concurrent use of all sound, but single channels)
Seems to have some nice envelope effects too. (presumably software since the envelope as sawtooth is used for other things)

Obviously not as good as the Amiga for most/all cases, but again, the point is sounding good in its own right. ;)

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same reason I'm pissed off at how underused they were for the pc engine chip. It's either awesome effects like in blood gear or xanadu, or good drums like in shockman, rarely both (there's soldier blade and a few others).

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A shame the PCE didn't have nice interval timers like the Lynx, POKEY, or many others to allow hardware timed MOD stuff. (especially since it uses a VERY interrupt-efficient 650x CPU -unlike Z80 or 68k which eat up tons of resource with interrupts -more so for 68k, so the "easy" hardware timed route isn't nearly as attractive -hence why PWM, or even PCM is relatively attractive on the A8, and had it been popular on the level of the C64, there definitely would have been games pushing that back then -interrupt driven PCM could allow a 4 kHz channel and still leave as much CPU time as the C64 -that's assuming the A8 has an effective 1.2 MHz after V-DMA)
Sega also screwed up by not supporting YM2612 interrupts. (Z80 isn't ideal for that, but would have greatly helped weaker programmers manage even PCM playback, especially while doing other tasks -I think a decent interrupt PCM routine could allow up to ~16 kHz with 100% Z80 usage, and given a lot of games dedicated the Z80 to driving much less than that -or equal to it for Atomic Runner/Vapor Trial- that's not bad at all)

As is is, you've at least got the 3.5/7 kHz timer and 15.7 kHz scanline interrupt to use on the PCE, so good for drums ans SFX at least. (and if you pair 2 channels, you can get up to 10-bit resolution)


And there's a reason the SN76489 is only on the list as a helper to the YM2612 ;)

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Also the jerk comment about putting it on the Master System.
SN76489 Alone = Crap.

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A real shame they didn't just use the YM2149 though (for the SG-1000, not SMS -lack of out of the box upgrade in the SMS is another issue ;) -not even dual PSG), same with the Colecovision.
The only good thing about the SN76489 is that it was cheap and small, and for dedicated sound you could probably cram 2 onboard for less cost than a YM2149 (maybe less than an AY8912 or even 8913). Plus, you could address the frequency range issue by clocking them differently. (as Sega did with the System 1's dual PSGs)
As such it was also a lot better than nothing (or close to it a la beeper/PC speaker), and a good low-cost option where nothing else fit. (a shame GCC didn't cram that into the 7800 as a quick-fix option -TIA+SN wouldn't have been a bad pairing for that matter) Interesting that the Speccy didn't go that route since it was so low-cost oriented and didn't use the I/O of the AY either.

I wasn't trying to be a jerk about it either, just expressing my feelings on the subject. (and again, the I/O should have greatly mitigated the added cost over the SN)
And if they HAD used the YM2149, the YM2203 might have been a logical upgrade once the Mk.III arrived. ;) (same footprint other than an added 8-pin skinny-DIP for the DAC)

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If you want to make a thread about pushing the chips, I have some demo tunes for the amiga I'd love to post :), and that awesome song by Follin for the MD would fit the bill perfectly too.

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Not so much about pushing chips, but about the context . . . and pushing things that SHOULD have been done back then, but weren't. (like the extremely poor -on average- use of PCM on the MD -shows how important a foolproof architecture is for "lazy" developers -or ones who put sound as a lower priority, POKEY is another case due to sheer lack of support, the AY got good support though, and plenty of good examples there)





And back to the YM2608, this is one of the better sound tracks doen on the PC8801 IMO:
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...0D7E0B6CA5DA17

I didn't mean you were a jerk kool kitty, The comment I made above the YM2143 music says that sega were jerks for not using it on the western versions of the Master System. Sorry for the confusion.

As for where you draw the line... well really it's a thing of feel... Using the CPU to help a little is ok, doing an entire song in PCM on a PSG chip is not what this is about.

Could you clarify something for me though, that soundtrack you posted sounds excellent, but before you said the PC8801 used the YM2203?

Were there versions with either chip? I'm not very familiar with it.

It sounds better than the song Kokujin posted so I'll add it anyway.

EDIT: That type of drums in turrican are fine, I don't like the tunes that much though, never been that big of a turrican fan.

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Originally Posted by Enternal

Time Trax is amazing...and its funny when I heard Rock And Roll racing, I thought of the Spiderman and X-men soundtrack then scrolled down to see it was the same guy :)

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It's a real shame it wasn't released, even if it was the same mediocre game as the SNES, at least it would have had good music. (rather than music even more mediocre than the gameplay as in the SNES)



And one more comment on the Turrican II soundtrack: it may not be the absolute best on the ST, but it's got to be up there (I'm not intimately familiar with the library though).
It's definitely up there with the best ST demo tunes I've heard. (that aren't MOD ;))

Jochen Hippel did a great job arranging/remixing Chris Huelsbeck's soundtrack!