Dreamcast or Saturn? Pros/Cons

I'm looking to purchase either a Dreamcast or Saturn. I don't know much about either system. I have only played Dreamcast a few times at a friend's house and never have played Saturn. I hear Saturn has a great lineup of shmups, which I love.
I know Dreamcast has MvC and Shenmue. Other than that I'm pretty much clueless about these systems and I'm not sure which one I should get.

So what are the pros and cons of each system? What system is better for what genre of games? Looking for any information that will help me decide which one to buy. I plan to get both eventually, but not for a while.

Believe it or not there is way more to play on the saturn, however its mostly all in Japanese and vastly more expensive. The dreamcast has a little bit of everything and some pretty strong games. Issue is the dc was only alive for 2 whole years really so while its games are good the quantity isnt high.

Saturn if you are good at stealing games. Dreamcast if not.

Saturn and Dreamcast are both great consoles, so choosing just one may be difficult. Both consoles have a great lineup of games, for the Saturn I'd recommend:

- Albert Odyssey: Legend of Eldean
- Virtua Cop & Virtua Cop 2(Virtua Cop 2 is also on the Dreamcast)
- Radiant Silvergun
- Nights
- Astal
- Fighting Vipers

For the Dreamcast, I'd recommend:

Phantasy Star Online(while the official servers are shut down, there's a private server on a website, but you can still play offline too)
- Ikaruga
- Grandia II
- Jet Grind Radio
- Skies of Arcadia
- Resident Evil: Code Veronica
- Sonic Adventure
- Legacy of Kain: Soul Reaver
- Power Stone & Power Stone 2
- Shenmue
- Bangai-O
- Soul Calibur

And there a lots more games on both consoles.


I would also like to add that the majority of great Dreamcast games are a lot cheaper than some of the best Saturn games. If you don't have a large income right now, perhaps you should aim for the Dreamcast, as you'll be able to rake in plenty of great games for cheap.:)

This is a highly despised topic of contention. >> The tail end of this thread is an exm of why: http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthr...ghlight=saturn
More Saturn at here: http://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?12932-Best-Saturn-games-(with-a-catch)
robivy also just had an inquiry thread for the #1 absolute must own, with a specific request for shmups, that I answered at length upon several genres.

Anyhow, to properly answer you, the Saturn is the better and harder shmup system. It boasts some renowned games of merciless difficulty (for mediocre players like me anyway; I can handle most of the Genny's stuff though) such as Darius Gaiden, Metal Black, and Gun Frontier which last is very much like a Shark game. It also has the Panzer Dragoons, which are superb 2nd-person shooters that incorporate full 3dimensionality (unlike Rez on the DC which is straightforward, no looking about).

----Since you're online now I'll post this so you can check those threads, then add more about the Saturn and get to the DC by edit.------------------

EDIT: ADDED THE FOLLOWING = (the SS has been too well covered of late, on to the DC).

from Clessy: "Issue is the dc was only alive for 2 whole years really so while its games are good the quantity isnt high." >> Quite erroneous regarding shmups, many of which were released after the system was officially dead. Neither system was supported long, and the DC may well have as many exclusives as the Saturn.

DC
Least Known Good Game = Lack of Love (aka 'LOL'). A puzzle/adventure game where you play a sort of martian bug that evolves by performing kind deeds in the natural world.
Best Marquee Titles = Ecco. Great music and 3D exploration. Jet Grind Radio. Graffiti exploration and racing (rollerblades). Crazy Taxi 2. Offbeat arcade style racing in bursts with an overall mission based feel; slightly obnoxious but worthwhile. Skies of Arcadia or Grania 2: neither is a personal rec, they're just well regarded.
Best Shmups = Mars Matrix. Fast, slightly evil bullet hell with no slowdown and relatively low difficulty to the genre; fullscreen yoko presentation. Shikigami no Shiro 2. I don't find this playable w/o tate setup, but it has its own cool atmosphere. Gigawing 2. Massive slowdown; if you can get past that it's a great game with the best soundtrack of the generation. Gigawing. Something of a compromise betwixt Mars Matrix and Gigawing 2 (they're all from Takumi-Capcom); hard. Rez. Optical treat; very light gameplay. Border Down. In many ways a very 16 bit shooter (hori) featuring a new but not revolutionary death penalty mechanic; can be frustrating. Trizeal. I believe this was the absolute last game released on the DC (`09?) and it's fantastic; nothing extra-16bit in gameplay, it just works well and sports some wonderful techno. Zero Gunner 2. Cool though generic looking helicopter game that involves turning/shooting in every direction; random early lv order; not bullet hell; easy/avg. Under Defeat. Fantasy WWII helicopter game with strict dynamic scrolling and approachable difficulty; practice options don't quite negate the frustration factor (lots of smoke during battle). Gunbird 2. Oldfashioned sprite based design with a faintly cutesy feel and high difficulty; short. Radirgy. Very well regarded cel shaded game I've yet to play, considered greatly superior to its PS2 incarnation. Chaos Field. Intense boss-only bullet hell; nevermind the N64 style graphics; really lacks nothing the GC version got. Last Hope: Pink Bullets. Very oldschool hori with outstanding sprite presentation.
Shmups to Skip = Psyvariar 2. Tinsely trash. Karasu (Karaus). Cel shaded but too grey: hard to see in w/o tate setup, and mediocre all the same. TriggerHeart Excelica. Way overuses its anchor technique. Dux. Colourful but lame R Type derivative...unless you adore R Type. Drill. Indie game derivative of Psyvariar and cheap feeling. Ikaruga. A slow puzzle game that overstates its lone idea ad nauseum; too bad the name 'Curse' was already taken.
Others to Get = Bangai-Oh. Flying sidescroller from Treasure, not a shmup as it's usually termed, unless you'd be willing to term Subterrania a shmup. Capcom vs Snk Millionnaire Pro. Everybody has a few moves cut out, and it's a 4 button game, but you can get some great matchups, edit colours, etc.
Others to Shun = Cannon Spike. A crappy runabout game that plays like an incredibly stupid, cheap, and tiny Smash TV. This turd is Killer Instinct bad. Marvel vs Capcom 1 and 2. Not quite KI bad here, but definitely Shaq Fu: button mashing bullshit with some idiotic characters (Amingo? Why?).
Gear = Nexus VMU. Connects to PC for downloading saves. Extra VMUs. These fill fast. Joystick (OEM or highend, not the cheapies) or Ascii Pad; at minimum a MadCatz controller. The point of all these is so you get some diagonals on your d-pad; the standard DC controller is the worst default since that old Atari RC-car type. There's also the Total Control 3/4, for converting PS2 or Saturn to DC; other brands/models exist but they're ill considered.

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Originally Posted by eddiespruce

Saturn and Dreamcast are both great consoles, so choosing just one may be difficult. Both consoles have a great lineup of games, for the Saturn I'd recommend:

- Albert Odyssey: Legend of Eldean

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Albert Odyssey is a disgraceful piece of shit. I understand the effort WD went through with butchering the game's script, rewriting lost game code, and their making load times more bearable in the end. The game still sucks disproportionately high amounts of ass. Fuck everything about it. It needs to be collectively rounded up, and forcefully shoved up Vic Ireland's ass one disc at a time.

DC has one of the best homebrew communities and requires no modding to play burnt games.
It also has an even range of titles. Quite a few gems too.

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Originally Posted by eddiespruce

- Radiant Silvergun

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I would just download the port on XBLA. I downloaded the Demo and was quite impressed with the care Treasure put into this port.

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Originally Posted by Knuckle Duster

Albert Odyssey is a disgraceful piece of shit. I understand the effort WD went through with butchering the game's script, rewriting lost game code, and their making load times more bearable in the end. The game still sucks disproportionately high amounts of ass. Fuck everything about it. It needs to be collectively rounded up, and forcefully shoved up Vic Ireland's ass one disc at a time.

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Well, I enjoyed it.:)

I also enjoyed Albert Odyssey but, its nothing compared to Magic Knight Rayearth.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

I also enjoyed Albert Odyssey but, its nothing compared to Magic Knight Rayearth.

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This!

Both are systems worth owning but I do like the Saturn more. Many of the best Saturn games are Japanese but don't let that deter you!

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Originally Posted by synbiosfan

This!

Both are systems worth owning but I do like the Saturn more. Many of the best Saturn games are Japanese but don't let that deter you!

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I think you quoted my wrong post :P

Anyways gonna take some time and name some games I enjoy from both instead of just giving such a blunt answer.

Saturn
Magic Knight Ray Earth: Probably my absolutely favorite game on the system.
Lunar 1: Japanese only ( you can get the enhanced video version also but you need a mpeg card which is about $30 )
Lunar 2 : Japanese only
Grandia: Japanese only
Samurai Shodown series: Japan only
Street Fighter Alpha 3: Japan only and requires the ram cart, this version is my favorite becides arcade.
Castlevania SOTN:Japan only, has more areas and allows you to play as maria and richter right from the start. If you have a psp just get the psp version instead now.
Rigid Lord Saga 1 & 2
Sword and Sorcery: Japan only
Shining Force 3, part 1 2 3: 2 & 3 are Japan only but, both have fan translations now.
Sonic Flicky Island: Totally under rated I love this damn game
Nights
Langrisser series: All Japanese but a series I could pass over.
Megaman X4
Megaman X3
Megaman 8
Suikoden: Most think its a playstation only game but its not
Vandal Hearts
Sakura Taisen 1 & 2: Japan only
Virtual Fighter 2
Fighters Megamix
Resident Evil



A lot of saturn stuff isnt exclusive but I think they're the better version.

Dreamcast
Soul Calibur
Dead Or Alive 3
Alpha 3
3rd Strike
Mark of the Wolves
Ikaruga
Border Down
Under Defeat
Fast Striker
Grandia 2
Skies of Arcadia
Sakura Taisen 3 & 4: Very hard to play without some basic understanding of japanese, actually a lot of understanding of japanese.
Sword of the Besezerk: Probably my favorite DC game
Sonic Adventure
Sonic Adventure 2
Shenmue 1 & 2
Resident Evil Code veronica
Unreal Tournament
Quake 3
Outtrigger ( I played this on the anniversary of the game every year with my buddy online until the server went down in 05 )
Jet Set Radio
Capcom Vs SNK 1 & 2: 2 if you want a better game, 1 if you're 2d whore and cant stand 3d
Phantasy Star Online v1 & v2.
Illbleed: So underrated and so fucking awesome.



BTW I wanted to go out of my way to let you know trizel and radiology are good awful. Pirate them, seriously. They got for ridiculous prices and suck compared to almost all other dc shooters.

The Dreamcast seems to have more good games but, they're all pick up and play. If you wanna have a "deep" experience its not likely to happen very often on the dc sans about 5 games. The saturn is more of a 1 player system except its excessive amount of fighting games. Then again the DC has tons of fighters too. They're both the "king of fighters" lol :P

I would not be able to choose between the Dreamcast or Saturn. Both are great systems for specific genre needs, especially Arcade/Action games.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

I think you quoted my wrong post :P

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Perhaps I should have multi-quoted you;)

Dreamcast
Pros: It's a Dreamcast
Cons: It didn't have a NiGHTS game.

Saturn
Pros: It had a NiGHTS game.
Cons: It's not a Dreamcast

:cool:

I recently talked my friend in buying a Dreamcast. Later, he bought a Saturn after I bought one...couldn't bear to be less cooler than me. ;)

Anyway, he's enjoying both, as am I, but he often confuses the 2 systems. Frankly I don't blame him. Aside from being SEGA products, they're externally very similar. Lots of hidden gems from multiple genres and genre bending titles. Both often have the definitive console ports for fighters and shmups. Both are also very good looking consoles IMO.

Personally I'm still getting to know the Saturn, but I'm continually surprised by what sweet games I find for it. However, I still think I prefer the Dreamcast for perhaps a very superficial reason - better 3D graphics. That and it's easier to find DC games in decent numbers at used game stores compared to the Saturn.

I wish my Dreamcast could just play all of Saturn's library perfectly and I could use the Saturn's controllers on my DC...only in a perfect world.

The Saturn bar none is the GREATEST console ever. There's a mix of great games for every genre just about (RPGs, Racing, Platformers, 2D Fighters, 3D Fighters, Shmups, etc.) and the controller is Jawusum.

Dreamcast is (In the words of Mr. Smith) tosh for being the beginning of degeneration for Sonic the Hedgehog.

OP - I'd buy a Saturn. Not as much to recommend on the DC that hasn't been ported to other systems.

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Originally Posted by Televator

I wish my Dreamcast could just play all of Saturn's library perfectly and I could use the Saturn's controllers on my DC...only in a perfect world.

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http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/i...stfightpad.png

Try these, if you haven't already - they're not quite as nice as the Saturn pads, and not great for everything, but not a terrible substitute.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

Dreamcast is (In the words of Mr. Smith) tosh for being the beginning of degeneration for Sonic the Hedgehog.

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I always thought it began with Sonic 3D on the Mega Drive. Sonic Adventure just furthered it.

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Originally Posted by Baloo

The Saturn bar none is the GREATEST console ever. There's a mix of great games for every genre just about (RPGs, Racing, Platformers, 2D Fighters, 3D Fighters, Shmups, etc.) and the controller is Jawusum.

Dreamcast is (In the words of Mr. Smith) tosh for being the beginning of degeneration for Sonic the Hedgehog.

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Oh, Sonic had been going down hill for quite by then. Sonic Adventure was merely a shortcut to the bottom. No, what really damned Sonic was his "90s edginess".

If you prefer 3D games, get a Dreamcast.
If you prefer 2D games, get a Saturn.

I'd go for a Saturn. IMO it has more good/excellent titles than Dreamcast.

Saturn also has Daytona USA, which is reason enough.

Dreamcast was the best console I owned for the short time I had it. Have no urge or want to get a Saturn.

Dreamcast: better graphics, cheaper stuff
Saturn: more worthwhile games, better controller, better in terms of human history

I cant believe they're people who don't like Sonic Adventure. It really lets me know half of you really do have brain damage. Sonic didnt suck until heroes. You could argue SA2 because everything except Sonic/Shadow stages.

I don't know about you, but I used to play great games like: Sonic 1, 2, 3 & Knuckles.
Sonic Adventure is kind an abortion when compared to those classics. I'd take Sonic 1 and 2 for SMS instead of Sonic Adventure. Call me brain damaged, old, whatever...
Great games are timeless IMO.
Sonic in 3D never did well, never... Proof is that they're still trying to find the right way to do it and many people just hate it.

The art & game design of Sonic Adventure is great when compared to most of the last Sonic games, but it just can't stand against the classics.

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Originally Posted by agostinhobaroners

I don't know about you, but I used to play great games like: Sonic 1, 2, 3 & Knuckles.
Sonic Adventure is kind an abortion when compared to those classics. I'd take Sonic 1 and 2 for SMS instead of Sonic Adventure. Call me brain damaged, old, whatever...
Great games are timeless IMO.
Sonic in 3D never did well, never... Proof is that they're still trying to find the right way to do it and many people just hate it.

The art & game design of Sonic Adventure is great when compared to most of the last Sonic games, but it just can't stand against the classics.

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Obviously you're totally wrong as usual. Sonic Adventure is the best selling DC game ever. Guess why? Because people liked it and it was good. Cry all you want and say it sucked but chance are since you're still living in 1993 you've never even played it.

While I don't like the tone or rudeness of this discussion, I do think Sonic Adventure is one of the best 3D Action Platformers ever made. I have spent considerable time both trying to figure out why people gripe about it and how to land the completely awesome shortcuts in my favorite levels.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

Sonic Adventure is the best selling DC game ever. Guess why? Because people liked it and it was good.

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It still was the 3D overhype times... Also, many fans were waiting for a true 3D game since Saturn's release, aside the BIG advertising campaign.
Sonic in 3D means decline, fail...

Numbers by numbers, Sonic The Hedgehog sold like 6xSonic Adventure.

It's just my opinion and some people think the same, Clessy. You'll have to live with it or add me to your ignore list.

Dreamcast has Chu Chu Rocket.

I'm not sure on anything else, but Chu Chu Rocket.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

I cant believe they're people who don't like Sonic Adventure. It really lets me know half of you really do have brain damage. Sonic didnt suck until heroes. You could argue SA2 because everything except Sonic/Shadow stages.

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It's full of glitches, cringeworthy voice acting, and those god-awful finding emerald bits, fishing bits and the Amy and E102 games that shouldnt even be in Sonic.

I also hate how they forced the "Eggman" name down our throats for the English version.

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Originally Posted by Bastardcat

I also hate how they forced the "Eggman" name down our throats for the English version.

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I know right like OMG HUGE DEAL! HOW DARE THEY *rolls eyes*

Its arguments like this that make me not take any of your guys opinions seriously

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Originally Posted by Gogogadget

It's full of glitches, cringeworthy voice acting, and those god-awful finding emerald bits, fishing bits and the Amy and E102 games that shouldnt even be in Sonic.

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"Unfortunately, it also included a huge cast expansion that introduced the aforementioned Big the Cat and a robot with a laser gun. It also did the one thing Sonic games never should do -- it slowed down."
"The extra dimension eventually added to Sonic games didn't inherently bother me, but all the other frills like bloated story arcs, bland exploration, and NPC interaction were real turnoffs,"
"If I wanted that kind of thing, I'd go play a role-playing game. I don't care what Sonic or his friends have to say, I just want to control Sonic as he runs really fast while collecting and killing."

Original Style
Pick Up & Play
Non-stop Action
Fun


After all, Saturn library has Out Run, Space Harrier, Galaxy Force II, After Burner II, Fantasy Zone, and Power Drift... + Sega Ages Memorial Collection.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

Its arguments like this that make me not take any of your guys opinions seriously

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They're games, clessy. Why so srs?

You've tossed out a couple of fallacious points, but I don't care to address them. Gaming hobbies and tastes could not be more inconsequential to me it the greater context of my life. Sonic the Hedgehog has no bearing on whether I take someone seriously about anything that really matters.

Anyone else remember how mind blowing Code Veronica was?

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Originally Posted by Bastardcat

Anyone else remember how mind blowing Code Veronica was?

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Everything on DC was mind blowing that first couple of months. Nothing blew more minds than Soul Calibur. A launch title and one of the best fucking examples of graphics.

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Originally Posted by agostinhobaroners

If you prefer 3D games, get a Dreamcast.
If you prefer 2D games, get a Saturn.

I'd go for a Saturn. IMO it has more good/excellent titles than Dreamcast.

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This is really the sum of it. I answered in my usual windy fashion, he unusually tersely. The DC also has E.G.G. and Timestalkers (ARGPs of very differents styles); add another if you want to include Soul Reaver enhanced from the PS. But setting aside its shooter catalogue I don't play my stack of DC games collectively as much as I replay Nights.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

I know right like OMG HUGE DEAL! HOW DARE THEY *rolls eyes*

Its arguments like this that make me not take any of your guys opinions seriously

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Quit acting like an asshole, will ya?

Personally, I don't care for Sonic Adventure either. Too much roaming around and not enough speed. The first level is fantastic, but the rest just get on my nerves, especially the Casino level. Why couldn't they all be just speed and running through? Not search for emerald shards and catch fish and play pinball.

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Originally Posted by Clessy

Everything on DC was mind blowing that first couple of months. Nothing blew more minds than Soul Calibur. A launch title and one of the best fucking examples of graphics.

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SC? I bought a heavy duty arcade stick just for SC!

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Originally Posted by Baloo

Quit acting like an asshole, will ya?

Personally, I don't care for Sonic Adventure either. Too much roaming around and not enough speed. The first level is fantastic, but the rest just get on my nerves, especially the Casino level. Why couldn't they all be just speed and running through? Not search for emerald shards and catch fish and play pinball.

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Look there is no rule that says I cant voice my opinion just like he did his.

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Originally Posted by Bastardcat

SC? I bought a heavy duty arcade stick just for SC!

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http://www.ebay.com/itm/DC-ARCADE-ST...item2c5b38bfcf

One of those?

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Originally Posted by agostinhobaroners

If you prefer 3D games, get a Dreamcast.
If you prefer 2D games, get a Saturn.

I'd go for a Saturn. IMO it has more good/excellent titles than Dreamcast.

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This is a nice concise way to look at it. The Saturn is a great 2d machine, and the DC a great 3d one. If you're a shmup fan, I understand that shmups for the DC have been released in Japan up until fairly recently. Both machines improve if you're willing to import. I have no idea bout DC shmups, but imported Saturn shmups can be expensive.

They're both great machines and I have trouble picking one over the other. If pressed, though, I give the edge to the DC. I had a lot of fun with it, and it's a great multiplayer machine (the original version of Virtua Tennis is till the best IMHO, as is Soul Calibur).