Why the Genesis video resolution was higher than most other systems at the time?

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Originally Posted by Barone

I think that wasn't Black_Tiger's point though.
Late 80s Capcom arcade releases were graphically impressive and frankly unmatched for the time IMO for the most part; and that's around the time the MD was released.
That was the period BT was talking about a few posts ago.

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before Mega Drive era Capcom was de CPS board and others weaker systems
and for me they are on the same level on the market
compare my one favority games by capcom that is Black Tiger and compare..

all from 87
http://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...kill-enemy.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...ity-region.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...and-escape.png

And before capcom going foward another companys did their jobs and amazing things
remenber that double dragon defines what is modern beat 'm up and are launched in 87 too
after that konami also release TMNT arcade game..
these games looks and sounds unbelivable at the time
and capcom have nothing near of that

only in 88 capcom release cps-1 board and steps over for a brief time over the others,
because every ones upgrades thair boards too and reachs the same level of quality
so i really dont undertand this hype

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Originally Posted by Barone

Later on other companies released games which also looked good, but many times their graphical quality relies on an atrocious amount of ROM usage; this is subjective but it's perfectly reasonable to question the animation quality of games which require much more ROM space in order to look as good as some older, less space-hungry games.
To be very honest, many Neo Geo games don't have stellar animation if you analyze them past their number of frames. And I think that's one of the aspects Black_Tiger was talking about.

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Its funny because what capcom did after be destroed in techs aspects by mvs games?
They just do the same... they simple launched the new board and increase the rom size and the games frame animations... nothing more than that... and did it again on cps3..

And on the same time the SNK using the same old MVS delivers the same quality or best visual quality tham capcom

*sigh*

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Originally Posted by Black_Tiger

I find it hard to believe that CPS1 and CPS2 alone aren't considered part of "the best looking games" of the 90's.

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Originally Posted by Black_Tiger

While playing arcade bitd, I always wondered why graphic quality peaked with Capcom games. The resolution and level of shading in CPS1 games really came through and Neo Geo games relied on artwork and animation through huge roms, but by the time the hardware started really doing that the 32-bit generation was already here.

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Originally Posted by Black_Tiger

What are the 16-bit console era arcade games by these other companies that Capcom's didn't look impressive compared to?

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Time frame: 1988-1994

Which games released in the same year by other companies for the arcades make the games listed below look NOT impressive?
1988:
Forgotten Worlds
Ghouls'n Ghosts

1989:
Dynasty Wars
Final Fight
Strider

1990:
Magic Sword
Mega Twins
Mercs

1991:
Captain Commando
Knights of the Round
Street Fighter II

1992:
Warriors of Fate

1993:
Cadillacs and Dinosaurs
Dungeons & Dragons : Tower of Doom
Eco Fighters
Muscle Bomber Duo : Heat Up Warriors
Super Street Fighter 2 : The New Challengers
The Punisher

1994:
Darkstalkers : The Night Warriors

Rsrs calm down.. lets go!

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Originally Posted by Barone

*sigh*

Time frame: 1988-1994

Which games released in the same year by other companies for the arcades make the games listed below look NOT impressive?
1988:
Forgotten Worlds
Ghouls'n Ghosts

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http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/gng...snghosts-1.pnghttp://www.hardcoregaming101.net/alt...redbeast-1.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1989:
Dynasty Wars
Final Fight
Strider

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http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/strider/strider-4.pnghttp://www.hardcoregaming101.net/shi.../sdancer-4.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1990:
Magic Sword
Mega Twins
Mercs

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http://www.arcade-museum.com/images/...8124213654.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...-face-kick.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1991:
Captain Commando
Knights of the Round
Street Fighter II

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http://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...ndo-with-a.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...l-japanese.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1992:
Warriors of Fate

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http://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...assar-demo.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...nshot-what.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1993:
Cadillacs and Dinosaurs
Dungeons & Dragons : Tower of Doom
Eco Fighters
Muscle Bomber Duo : Heat Up Warriors
Super Street Fighter 2 : The New Challengers
The Punisher

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http://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...legs-drill.pnghttp://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...-over-here.png

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Originally Posted by Barone

1994:
Darkstalkers : The Night Warriors

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http://www.mobygames.com/images/shot...t-anakaris.pnghttp://www.vgmuseum.com/end/arcade/c/kiboss-1.png

Its just few examples from my head..
i cant do it with everything thats you spoke here
but tell me where the big diference there?

And didn't take in comparison games that's is not a normal cabinet
for example while in 94 capcom release Darkstalkers, SEGA are lauching Daytona USA arcade..

so for me again...
i'm sorry but the capcom never was a top hardware company
that's delivers the best graphics on the arcades
their strong point will be always the games itself
and i love them, belive me.

I'm calm but I think you kinda ruined the discussion by putting it out of original context; and just went completely superficial with screenshot comparisons like that.

Ghouls'n Ghosts has far richer animation than Altered Beast whose backgrounds are pretty much static and dull looking.

Shadow Dancer's shading is atrocious and it's basically an 8-bit arcade game on steroids.

Pit Fighter looks like ass. Terrible animation, horrid shading.

Blade Master's backgrounds are a dithering fest and the shading is noticeably inferior to Captain Commando's. The Capcom game supports up to 4 simultaneous players, Blade Master only two; the enemies animation, the variety of enemies, backgrounds, etc. are in a different league.

Golden Axe: The Revenge of Death Adder is a mess IMO. Some parts look good, some parts look OK, others look bad. The color use is inconsistent and so is the texturing of the backgrounds and some of the enemies. There's enemies whose the mask has virtually no shading, it's odd.
Then you look at the characters themselves, most of them don't really look good; I mean, the art itself is very questionable in terms of how they look standing and how they transition form one frame to another when walking.
Warriors of Fate has its flaws too (the backgrounds look repetitive and generic, some dithering there too, color use is not great, etc.) but I still find the characters looking and animation far superior to Golden Axe: The Revenge of Death Adder.

MKII runs at higher resolution but its backgrounds are static for the most part. I also don't think the characters animate that well.
Killer Instinct has similar flaws IMO.

Blade Master has lots of dithering but it's still a pretty and detailed game imo, the bosses definitely were more impressive than the ones ones on Captain Commando. The other Irem beat 'em ups looked even better though, and on par with anything by Capcom

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Originally Posted by Barone

I'm calm but I think you kinda ruined the discussion by putting it out of original context; and just went completely superficial with screenshot comparisons like that.

Ghouls'n Ghosts has far richer animation than Altered Beast whose backgrounds are pretty much static and dull looking.

Shadow Dancer's shading is atrocious and it's basically an 8-bit arcade game on steroids.

Pit Fighter looks like ass. Terrible animation, horrid shading.

Blade Master's backgrounds are a dithering fest and the shading is noticeably inferior to Captain Commando's. The Capcom game supports up to 4 simultaneous players, Blade Master only two; the enemies animation, the variety of enemies, backgrounds, etc. are in a different league.

Golden Axe: The Revenge of Death Adder is a mess IMO. Some parts look good, some parts look OK, others look bad. The color use is inconsistent and so is the texturing of the backgrounds and some of the enemies. There's enemies whose the mask has virtually no shading, it's odd.
Then you look at the characters themselves, most of them don't really look good; I mean, the art itself is very questionable in terms of how they look standing and how they transition form one frame to another when walking.
Warriors of Fate has its flaws too (the backgrounds look repetitive and generic, some dithering there too, color use is not great, etc.) but I still find the characters looking and animation far superior to Golden Axe: The Revenge of Death Adder.

MKII runs at higher resolution but its backgrounds are static for the most part. I also don't think the characters animate that well.
Killer Instinct has similar flaws IMO.

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Its overlooking again...
is very easy found something you dosen't like on 1 title and try overlook what you like on capcom side..
its just your personal taste
you have to decide.. one time you dosent like a technical aspect or artistic element or gameplay style
and we talking about graphics just it..
you even talking about 4 players aspect and data east, konami and sega did it before capcom
again.. capcom did nothing impressive and new

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Originally Posted by Vludi

Blade Master has lots of dithering but it's still a pretty and detailed game imo, the bosses definitely were more impressive than the ones ones on Captain Commando. The other Irem beat 'em ups looked even better though, and on par with anything by Capcom

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Yes, its just a diferent artisct style.. capcom always comes to something more cartoon and hq, blade master have a euro painting style, much more detail in every sprite on the screen, backgrounds are nicer and richer.. but again its a artisct choice not a hardware limitation its simple..

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Originally Posted by Pyron

Its overlooking again...
is very easy found something you dosen't like on 1 title and try overlook what you like on capcom side..
its just your personal taste
you have to decide.. one time you dosent like a technical aspect or artistic element or gameplay style
and we talking about graphics just it..
you even talking about 4 players aspect and data east, konami and sega did it before capcom
again.. capcom did nothing impressive and new

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Originally Posted by Pyron

Yes, its just a diferent artisct style.. capcom always comes to something more cartoon and hq, blade master have a euro painting style, much more detail in every sprite on the screen, backgrounds are nicer and richer.. but again its a artisct choice not a hardware limitation its simple..

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I think you're completely wrong and completely missed the point many times... But I'll stop here since I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

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Originally Posted by Barone

I think you're completely wrong and completely missed the point many times... But I'll stop here since I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

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OMG i'm sorry...
We start talking about res, visual quality, rom space, shading and etc.. etc...
and later you are talking about gameplay aspects, artisct elements and etc..
thats all subjetive and your personal preference..
so i really miss your point here sorry

You seem to think vomiting screenshots to a thread is a great argument; it's not.

If you want to discuss about graphics quality.
You have to speak about high level pixel art of Irem and Toaplan. ( dogyunn, in the hunt etc...)
About resolutions, Irem at the end of 80's was on 384*256 ( Irem M72 : R-type, ninja spirit, dragon breed etc...)

http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=738

And later beginning of 90's , Irem M92 was on 320*240. ( undercover cops, in the hunt, gunforce 2...)

About Capcom, before cps 1 , street fighter 1 and Side Arms was already on 384*224.

Graphically, Cps1 was a graphical revolution at the time, combination of 384*224 with modern design for the time.
Cps 1 was all about graphics and great gameplay and replay-value, no use of multiple background layers ( just two and rarely 3 background layers ) , no zoom, no special effects.
Thanks to great graphics, great gameplay and replay-value, they have developed great masterpiece.
Just the first game, Forgotten World is a total success.
Also Irem was on the same style, top notch graphics, great gameplay and no use of special effects.
For special effects, it was more Taito, Sega,Namco, Konami... that used super-scalers, rotations etc...

Please, if you want to dream about arcade , watch AM Show and Aou Show 1991, 1992 :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3Sg4brHu8g

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Originally Posted by sengoku 2

If you want to discuss about graphics quality.
You have to speak about high level pixel art of Irem and Toaplan. ( dogyunn, in the hunt etc...)
About resolutions, Irem at the end of 80's was on 384*256 ( Irem M72 : R-type, ninja spirit, dragon breed etc...)

http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=738

And later beginning of 90's , Irem M92 was on 320*240. ( undercover cops, in the hunt, gunforce 2...)

About Capcom, before cps 1 , street fighter 1 and Side Arms was already on 384*224.

Graphically, Cps1 was a graphical revolution at the time, combination of 384*224 with modern design for the time.
Cps 1 was all about graphics and great gameplay and replay-value, no use of multiple background layers ( just two and rarely 3 background layers ) , no zoom, no special effects.
Thanks to great graphics, great gameplay and replay-value, they have developed great masterpiece.
Just the first game, Forgotten World is a total success.
Also Irem was on the same style, top notch graphics, great gameplay and no use of special effects.
For special effects, it was more Taito, Sega,Namco, Konami... that used super-scalers, rotations etc...

Please, if you want to dream about arcade , watch AM Show and Aou Show 1991, 1992 :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3Sg4brHu8g

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This!

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Originally Posted by Barone

You seem to think vomiting screenshots to a thread is a great argument; it's not.

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We are talking about graphics and show some images helps to ilustrate some point
also you can said alot of stuff here.. thats cps-1 runs on 384*224 thats really a advantage
but you back in 80's and 90's you really know something about that? NO
you just going to machine look at screen and feel the game and presetation
and for everyoje in the time looks just another game runing in 320x224 on the side

lets talk about it..
Take your example, you said alot of captain commando, about 4 players cabinet, gameplay and etc..
in the same year we are playing turtles in time on arcades
have the 4 players coop, much bether animation, bether music, bether voices, full voice over intro,
cool presentation between stages, cool bosses, scaling effects, more dinamic and fun gameplay
one of the bests beat 'em ups out there..

its simple

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sengoku 2

If you want to discuss about graphics quality.
You have to speak about high level pixel art of Irem and Toaplan. ( dogyunn, in the hunt etc...)
About resolutions, Irem at the end of 80's was on 384*256 ( Irem M72 : R-type, ninja spirit, dragon breed etc...)

http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=738

And later beginning of 90's , Irem M92 was on 320*240. ( undercover cops, in the hunt, gunforce 2...)

About Capcom, before cps 1 , street fighter 1 and Side Arms was already on 384*224.

Graphically, Cps1 was a graphical revolution at the time, combination of 384*224 with modern design for the time.
Cps 1 was all about graphics and great gameplay and replay-value, no use of multiple background layers ( just two and rarely 3 background layers ) , no zoom, no special effects.
Thanks to great graphics, great gameplay and replay-value, they have developed great masterpiece.
Just the first game, Forgotten World is a total success.
Also Irem was on the same style, top notch graphics, great gameplay and no use of special effects.
For special effects, it was more Taito, Sega,Namco, Konami... that used super-scalers, rotations etc...

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Yes, and in the hunt runs over the same board that they made blade master, because that i said its just a artisct choice and not a hardware limitation

Yes, i'm agree with you, it is a different style and also great pixel art and not a hardware limitation.
Undercover cops has also this colors choice and everyone is agree about high level pixel art of this game.

Arcade pcb :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZblYfUN_Q0

Before neo geo, most SNK games was on 256*224. ( beast buster, prehistoric isle in 1930, street smart, POW etc...)
But there was also some SNK games on 384*224 ( or 224*384 for vertical games ). ( psycho soldier, bermuda triangle,guerilla war...)