Best graphic of the 16 bit era..

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12-17-2012, 03:34 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Lion King is another that = no component, it needs to blend a lot on several levels or it looks weird; better on SNES.

I had to put it there because depending on the stage it looks better on either system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

And if anything's aged it's Sylpheed

Of all the 3D games it and Geograph Seal are the only that aged well IMO, mainly due to having a decent framerate and enough craziness going on to not feel stale. Starfox unfortunately did not age as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Gunstar Heroes has some mediocre stages

True, Alien Soldier too, and that one also has really crappy colors at times.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Which is the "first" stage of TF4

The one that gets selected by default first. It has mountains and water.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Flink's palette sucks too.

I used to think that too, but now I favor it over the rainbow graphics common on the genesis. It has a smoothness very few genesis games have. Ecco TToT is another.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Btw do you know Rudra no Hihou? Just, say, for reference's sake?

It's not there for the same reason FF6 and CT aren't, it's beaten by other far more impressive looking RPGs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Pretty much every TCD game has a lot of tradeoffs to me, eg Solid Force's maps.

True, but it's still the best looking strategy RPG on the system.

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Is Genocide 2 better looking than the SNES version? I considered that one.

Yes.
12-17-2012, 04:16 PM
Black_Tiger

Quote:

Pretty much every TCD game has a lot of tradeoffs to me, eg Solid Force's maps. I almost put in Hi Leg Fantasy.*

No more so than most Genesis and SNES games.. What's the difference?

Hi Leg Fantasy ranges from fugly to hideous.

Quote:

@ Trekkies (and Kamahl): PS2 has tons more battle animation than any 8 bit RPG; play it in slow motion (Start + B). And for me backgrounds do absolutely nothing unless they animate or the fighting sprites move about them. The dungeons are still far more diverse than most SNES RPGs' even if many on MD diversify things more.

Except Phantasy Star. Unless tiny frames are equal to or greater than larger more detailed ones. Phantasy Star even has animation in its (full screen!] backgrounds.
12-17-2012, 04:40 PM
TrekkiesUnite118

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

:

@ Trekkies (and Kamahl): PS2 has tons more battle animation than any 8 bit RPG; play it in slow motion (Start + B). And for me backgrounds do absolutely nothing unless they animate or the fighting sprites move about them. The dungeons are still far more diverse than most SNES RPGs' even if many on MD diversify things more.

The Original Phantasy Star says hi. Yes it only ever has 1 sprite per enemy type, it still looks better in my opinion with better animations and battle backgrounds. Honestly I'd say on average the first Phantasy Star has better graphics than the 2nd one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakon

FF4 from my memory was supposed to be a nes game I believe they even got it somewhat finished on the nes then abandoned that to have it on the snes instead. The graphics in ff5 are nothing special either, still I'm amazed how much ff4 has considering it's such a tiny rom.

From what I remember though what became FF4 was being developed at the same time as Final Fantasy 5. When the NES FF4 got cancelled they simply changed the name of the one they were already working on for the SNES. So it's not like say Shenmue where things were being carried over/converted from an earlier console version.
12-17-2012, 04:58 PM
StarMist

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black_Tiger

No more so than most Genesis and SNES games.. What's the difference?

Something like Shining Force still looks good on its map screen; not the same level as its combat animations, but good. And the reason Dracula X is in there rather than Chi no Rinne (the better game) is that the TCD version has some very bare playing fields that do not match the quality of its sprites and special effects.

Quote:

Hi Leg Fantasy ranges from fugly to hideous.

Then we can make a special thread for it and the Monster Boy series.

Quote:

Except Phantasy Star. Unless tiny frames are equal to or greater than larger more detailed ones. Phantasy Star even has animation in its (full screen!] backgrounds.

You're right: all 4 (four) visible player characters in Phantasy Star SMS have more animation than the 0 (zero) visible player characters in Phantasy Star II. :roll:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

It's not there for the same reason FF6 and CT aren't, it's beaten by other far more impressive looking RPGs.

No, it's certainly not, I was really just wondering whether you'd played it, but then of course you aren't in to such time consuming games anymore, so the query just came out waffly. It actually may be on the short side, unless one has to play all three characters' quests, but I got bored of it about six hours in.
12-17-2012, 05:20 PM
magicalsoundshower

Kamahl's verdict on the Amiga is pretty harsh, but I see where he's coming from. I still recommend James Pond 1 and 2 if you're looking for platformers that actually aged well graphically. There's tons of gradient abuse in those games, I admit, but it you're going for the cutesy look, free colors is always a plus. And as a result, the Genesis ports of both games look downright horrid.

The best-looking shmup on the Amiga is most definitely Apidya. It hardly ever parallax scrolls (but when it does, it looks awesome), but still looks 16-bit through and through.

Some of the later levels of Lionheart look spectacular for the hardware, though, although I can see how the bland foreground graphics of the first stage could turn a lot of people off.
12-17-2012, 05:41 PM
TrekkiesUnite118

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

You're right: all 4 (four) visible player characters in Phantasy Star SMS have more animation than the 0 (zero) visible player characters in Phantasy Star II. :roll:

The enemies have better animations in the original Phantasy Star. And again there are backgrounds. If PSII had unique battle backgrounds, a bit more unique enemy animations, and less repetitive looking dungeons I'd be fine with it, but as it stands it feels very 8-bit at times. There are a few times it has some 16-bit characteristics, but a lot of the game feels 8-bit. I most certainly wouldn't have it on my list of best looking Genesis games.

Even the shops and towns look better in the Original Phantasy Star.
12-17-2012, 05:51 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by magicalsoundshower

The best-looking shmup on the Amiga is most definitely Apidya. It hardly ever parallax scrolls (but when it does, it looks awesome), but still looks 16-bit through and through.

The quality of the artwork gets progressively worse in apidya. The first stages look good, the sewer kinda crappy, and the last stage horrid. You're right that the stages with parallax look freaking amazing, and the game should be on the list for them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by magicalsoundshower

Some of the later levels of Lionheart look spectacular for the hardware, though, although I can see how the bland foreground graphics of the first stage could turn a lot of people off.

The lava stage and dinosaur ride stage look amazing. When inside a cave or something the game looks awesome too. The first stage looks like a monochrome mess over a rainbow mess, and the stage without parallax just looks weird.
12-17-2012, 05:54 PM
Thenewguy

Quote:

Originally Posted by magicalsoundshower

Kamahl's verdict on the Amiga is pretty harsh, but I see where he's coming from.

Pffft, rubbish, he has one set of rules for one system, and another for another.

He picks holes in every Amiga game there and then lists shit like Kaze Kiri?

Puggsy has a shittier main character than Kid Chaos.

A bunch of the PC-Engine games have no parallax scrolling.

Genesis Lion King has loads of dithering

etc etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by magicalsoundshower

I still recommend James Pond 1 and 2 if you're looking for platformers that actually aged well graphically. There's tons of gradient abuse in those games, I admit, but it you're going for the cutesy look, free colors is always a plus.

Brian the Lion has some fairly cool effects.

Bear in mind this is GIF is like 2/3rd actual speed

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/4563/brian.gif
12-17-2012, 06:02 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

Puggsy has a shittier main character than Kid Chaos.

No main character is worse than Kid Chaos.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

A bunch of the PC-Engine games have no parallax scrolling.

You don't see any legendary axe or bonk on the list now do you? Why does an RPG need parallax scrolling?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

Genesis Lion King has loads of dithering

7 color foregrounds on the amiga. 7. 7 which are shared with the enemies, unlike at least 16+16 on the genesis.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

Brian the Lion has some fairly cool effects.

You're very right, my hatred for the game made me forget it. Awesome looking effects at times, and even the regular game looks good. Should totally be on the list.
12-17-2012, 06:18 PM
Thenewguy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

No main character is worse than Kid Chaos.

I don't see how they're even remotely comparable.

Puggsy looks like someone took a shit on the floor, and then animated it.

Worst character design ever (I don't have a problem with the game though, or any other graphics in the game)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

Why does an RPG need parallax scrolling?

Kazi Kiri is an action game, which alternates between no parallax, and pathetic foreground parallax.

Blood Gear is an Action Adventure/RPG style game, with no parallax.
12-17-2012, 06:22 PM
StarMist

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118

If PSII had unique battle backgrounds

I stand by my disregard for static, highly repeated backgrounds. If every room in an RPG had its own background that would be very different and awesome, but no. If you want plastered on backgrounds go for the SFC Dragon Quests.

Quote:

a bit more unique enemy animations

But again, we have the main characters' animations, which even vary by weapon equipped. All that's missing to me are shields' showing up.

Quote:

I most certainly wouldn't have it on my list of best looking Genesis games.

You're welcome to your own tastes.

Quote:

Even the shops and towns look better in the Original Phantasy Star.

:rofl:
Then I have to add Final Fantasy 1, 2, and 3 on NES amongst the best looking 16 bit games.
12-17-2012, 06:34 PM
TrekkiesUnite118

I never said the original Phantasy Star was the best looking 16-bit game. I said I wouldn't consider Phantasy Star II one of the best looking 16-bit games because it's barely a step above it's predecessor and in some ways it's a step backwards. You're honestly telling me you would rather have the blue grid backgrounds instead of the backgrounds we have in Phantasy Star IV and even the original Phantasy Star?

Yeah there's now main character sprites in battle, but again I'd be happier if we had battle backgrounds and more sensible animations. Seriously how the hell does a rabbit spilling it's intestines on the ground hurt you?
12-17-2012, 07:10 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

Kazi Kiri is an action game, which alternates between no parallax, and pathetic foreground parallax.

The parallax makes sense at least. It has line scrolling outside, and foreground scrolling inside the building. For a system with no parallax scrolling at least the game tried to do something.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

Blood Gear is an Action Adventure/RPG style game, with no parallax.

That's incorrect, some stages do have parallax and they look freaking awesome (that's why I said some stages). Shame they're so few as they're some of the best looking moments on the PCE.
12-17-2012, 07:29 PM
QuickSciFi

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry coeurl

We would know what you were talking about, for one. :D

I've made a point of it already in at least two thread, and even have provided pictures and video. If my schedule allows for perusing my way through google and youtube, I'll see about adding some media.
12-17-2012, 07:34 PM
Chilly Willy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

7 color foregrounds on the amiga. 7. 7 which are shared with the enemies, unlike at least 16+16 on the genesis.

Not sure what you mean here, but specifically, dual playfield uses the first 8 color registers for PF1, and the second 8 for PF2 (colors 0 and 8 are transparent). These are completely separate from the colors used by sprites! Sprites always use colors 17 to 31.

In case you need a chart to help visualize this, here are some doc pages to help:
dual-playfield colors
sprite colors
12-17-2012, 07:54 PM
StarMist

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118

You're honestly telling me you would rather have the blue grid backgrounds instead of the backgrounds we have in Phantasy Star IV and even the original Phantasy Star?

Yep, especially over PS1's. Those backgrounds reduce the contrast with the sprites, and this isn't the SNES or something where there are enough colours to choose from to produce something of different intensity. I'd rather have highly individualised backgrounds, very well tuned backgrounds (eg Rudra no Hihou), plain enough backgrounds not to be distracting (Mystic Ark, 7th Saga; for a 1stP RPG exm Soul Hackers), or a tilting background something like the lawns in Ace wo Nerae! but naturally with more detail. PS1 and PSIV's backgrounds are distracting, though PSIV's are less so. The gridwork could be total black instead.

Quote:

Seriously how the hell does a rabbit spilling it's intestines on the ground hurt you?

By spending 31k a year on video games.
12-17-2012, 07:57 PM
TrekkiesUnite118

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Yep, especially over PS1's. Those backgrounds reduce the contrast with the sprites, and this isn't the SNES or something where there are enough colours to choose from to produce something of different intensity. I'd rather have highly individualised backgrounds, very well tuned backgrounds (eg Rudra no Hihou), plain enough backgrounds not to be distracting (Mystic Ark, 7th Saga; for a 1stP RPG exm Soul Hackers), or a tilting background something like the lawns in Ace wo Nerae! but naturally with more detail. PS1 and PSIV's backgrounds are distracting, though PSIV's are less so. The gridwork could be total black instead.

Again, how does this give the game the honor of having some of the best graphics of the 16-bit era. It's barely a step above 8-bit.
12-17-2012, 08:02 PM
Drakon

Man, I havn't read a starmist post in forever. Usually the first sentence makes me lose interest. For the sake of keeping your brain cells perhaps you should do the same.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118

Again, how does this give the game the honor of having some of the best graphics of the 16-bit era. It's barely a step above 8-bit.
12-17-2012, 09:40 PM
Black_Tiger

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuickSciFi

The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
Just mentioning this game should be enough. If one is not satisfied or lacks knowledge of the game, then I'd go on to mention it's 1991 release date. It's unbelievable how flawless this game looks (I would go on to talk about gameplay and other such things, but we're talking amazing graphics here).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakon

One thing that amazes me with some older games is how much game they managed to fit into small maskroms. Both final fantasy 4 and zelda link to the past are 8mbit. That's a lot of game stuffed into those tiny chips.

I've never understood how people sometimes cite LttP as an example of great graphics, Nintendo goggles aside. I love that kind of faux-simple pixel art style of graphics and Hudson Soft is great at it, but LttP has always seemed bland and super repetitive to me, even for a 1991 game (SNES hit the ground running with Super GnG). It's not bad looking, it just comes off as very plain and unambitious. As for the size, I'm surprised it's not a 4 meg game. If you compare the 8 meg LttP to the similar faux-simple style visuals of the 8 meg Bomberman '94, LttP ends up looking more like an unremarkable 2 meg NES game. Which is why it translated so well to Gameboy.

I'd have pegged Final Fantasy II at 6 megs, but maybe the sound samples eat up a bunch of space. I love the game, but it looks like a recolored update of the Famicom Final Fantasy III.

http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiii1.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiv1a.png
http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiii2.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiv2a.png
http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiii3.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiv3.gif
http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiii4.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/ffiv4.png
12-17-2012, 10:03 PM
Drakon

Yeah ff4 does certainly does carry on the feel of ff3. And since ff3 (famicom) rocks, I don't mind!
12-17-2012, 10:23 PM
Saturn Fan

Quote:

Originally Posted by GriskaGyoran

I actually thought the game was quite ugly.

No way. The game looked and sounded(and played) great.

It was a 32-bit quality, 3D platformer on the stock, aging SNES hardware. Back when Rare were still putting out stellar work.
12-17-2012, 10:33 PM
jerry coeurl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakon

Man, I havn't read a starmist post in forever. Usually the first sentence makes me lose interest. For the sake of keeping your brain cells perhaps you should do the same.

At least he knows how to properly format a response.
12-17-2012, 10:41 PM
Black_Tiger

Quote:

Quote:

Except Phantasy Star. Unless tiny frames are equal to or greater than larger more detailed ones. Phantasy Star even has animation in its (full screen!] backgrounds.

You're right: all 4 (four) visible player characters in Phantasy Star SMS have more animation than the 0 (zero) visible player characters in Phantasy Star II. :roll:

I hope that you're just playing dumb. I was obviously talking about the enemies in the fights. You're the one arguing that no background art is better. The player's attacks in Phantasy Star still have a lot of nice and large animation, but I can't find sprite rips for it.

The Phantasy Star player map sprites are definitely better animated. Separate from the size of the enemies, the artwork for the them is much better in Phantasy Star (and they have a similar level of shading/color as PSII's), although it's not saying much since PSII's roster is padded with many fugly or boring enemies.

But the fact that it's splitting hairs at best shows how little Phantasy Star II improved or added over the original, which to be fair was the most impressive game of its time and still looks great today.

http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/mammoth1.png

http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/pssmsp.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/psiip.png

http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/darkforcesms.png http://superpcenginegrafx.net/misc/darkforcemd.png

Quote:

Originally Posted by Drakon

Yeah ff4 does certainly does carry on the feel of ff3. And since ff3 (famicom) rocks, I don't mind!

Yeah, it only made FFIII all the more impressive when I finally got to play it years later.
12-18-2012, 05:57 AM
Team Andromeda

Just to keep it to Snes and Mega CD for a min

Soul Star (Mega CD) - Must have pushed the system to its limits

Battle Corps Mega CD)

Batman Returns (Mega CD) the driving sections looked as good as Coin Ups for crying out loud

Cliffhanger (Mega CD) The Snowboard section again were of pure coin up quality

Evander Holyfield Real Deal Boxing (MD) Massive sprites and an amazing rotation effect on the backround

Axleay (Snes - Still looks and sounds stunning

Mickey Mouse and Donald Duck (MD) stunning in everyway

Quackshot (MD)- Some of the best scrolling ever seen

Thunder Force IV (MD) - Looks better than most Neo Geo shooters

Boogerman (MD)- A overlooked classic that is features stunning graphics and animation

F-Zero (F-Zero)- Still to to this say looks awesome

Batman & Robin (MD) Must use everthing the MD had to offer .

Wonderdog (mega CD) lovely scrolling and stunning art.

Aladdin (Mega Drive) Just stunning

Streets of Rage II (MD) - Looked to be every bit has good as a Neo Geo game

Castle of Illusion (Mega Drive) To me this is one of the best looking games ever made on the MD

Mickey Mannia - Just stunning effects

Revenge of Shinobi (MD) - Still love the scrolling and the explosion effects

Contra III - To me those Mode 7 effects were jaw dropping at the time

Super Castlevania IV (Snes)- Just stunning to look at and listen too

Lunar II - Mega CD - Amazing animation imo

Urusei Yatsura: My Dear Friends (mega CD) its like playing a real time cartoon
12-18-2012, 06:01 AM
StarMist

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black_Tiger

I hope that you're just playing dumb.

Right back atcha.

Quote:

I was obviously talking about the enemies in the fights.

Of course you were. What a convenient little straw man where you get to focus on the thing your game does well while ignoring what it doesn't even attempt; for my part I've owned that the absence of backgrounds in PSII doesn't bother me and is better than a very few insipid, low contrast images.

Quote:

You're the one arguing that no background art is better.

Yes, better than PS1's.

Quote:

But the fact that it's splitting hairs at best shows how little Phantasy Star II improved or added over the original, which to be fair was the most impressive game of its time and still looks great today.

Sure it was. You're welcome to think that but merely stating it doesn't make it so. I'd take any NES RPG over it: most look better, sound leagues better, and even when neither (Ghost Lion) are much more fun.
12-18-2012, 07:41 AM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chilly Willy

Not sure what you mean here, but specifically, dual playfield uses the first 8 color registers for PF1, and the second 8 for PF2 (colors 0 and 8 are transparent). These are completely separate from the colors used by sprites! Sprites always use colors 17 to 31.

Sprites aren't used for anything but the main character and his weapons on the Amiga on nearly every game except Shadow of the Beast 1, and that one has horrible 3 color sprites. Let's be realistic. You get 7 colors for the foreground that are shared with every enemy since they're blitted, not sprites. See Agony, Jim Power, Wolfchild, Kid Chaos, Lionheart and Mr. Nutz for examples.

What I don't get is why no game uses two simple 3-color sprites repeated to make the background. A bit static sure but at least you'd still have 5-6 sprites remaining for the main character and UI/Weapons, plus a 16/32 color foreground (32 if using EHB).

The Amiga was really underused.

And you keep assuming I don't know I'm talking about, this is around the 4th time you've done it, really I'd think you'd have learned by now.
12-18-2012, 09:04 AM
sheath

Revenge of Shinobi: @3:33
http://youtu.be/4BMDT6QA70o?t=3m35s

Ninja Spirit:
http://www.gamepilgrimage.com/sites/...aSpirit007.png

http://www.gamepilgrimage.com/sites/...aSpirit013.png

http://www.gamepilgrimage.com/sites/...aSpirit020.png

These heralded 16-bittness to me and I thought the rest of the generation was a gradual decline in art quality.
12-18-2012, 11:29 AM
TrekkiesUnite118

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

Right back atcha.
Of course you were. What a convenient little straw man where you get to focus on the thing your game does well while ignoring what it doesn't even attempt; for my part I've owned that the absence of backgrounds in PSII doesn't bother me and is better than a very few insipid, low contrast images.

Yes, better than PS1's.

Sure it was. You're welcome to think that but merely stating it doesn't make it so. I'd take any NES RPG over it: most look better, sound leagues better, and even when neither (Ghost Lion) are much more fun.

My god are you an obsessed little fanboy over this game. While the game is good and is a classic it's not without it's flaws. The overworld graphics are barely a step above the Original Phantasy Star, the character sprites on the overworld map have less animation as well. Some enemies actually have less animation or their animations are pathetic compared to their Phantasy Star 1 counterparts. And then there's the issue of no battle background art. Regardless of whether or not you like the blue grid background, it doesn't change the fact that going from unique battle backgrounds to a single blue grid background is a step backwards. I wouldn't be surprised if the blue grid is actually a development placeholder for real backgrounds that never got implemented.

The game isn't bad, but it does lack the polish the first game had. And that's not even getting into the other issues that make it in many ways a step backwards from the original Phantasy Star.
12-18-2012, 11:44 AM
Drakon

Atleast I'm not bitter. Don't like it? Then do what I do, just don't read it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerry coeurl

At least he knows how to properly format a response.

Uhh....f-zero....really? The graphics are simple without the mode-7 stuff the game would look horrible.
12-18-2012, 12:11 PM
Black_Tiger

Phantasy Star II is what it is. It's a unique game that hasn't aged well, got by at the time for being released so early on in the generation and should be appreciated own its own, not compared to other games.
12-18-2012, 12:17 PM
StarMist

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118

My god are you an obsessed little fanboy over this game.

Thanks. It's always amusing when you call anyone a fanboy. Btw I'm not the one who dragged an 8 bit game into the discussion.

re PSII: I chose the game for its aesthetics. Most of the games listed so far as technical showcases get plowed over by a hundred NeoGeo games anyway.

@ Kamahl/Thenewguy: what's the name of the background effect in that Brian the Lion gif?

@ Barone: I overlooked that you named Roadblasters earlier. Good choice, and I knew I should've had a racing game in there. I think Top Gear 2 SNES was already listed before me. Speed Racer SNES has hills but is a bit weak nonetheless.
12-18-2012, 12:19 PM
TrekkiesUnite118

There are plenty of better looking games on the Genesis with similar aesthetics to Phantasy Star II. For example Phantasy Star IV. I only brought up the Original Phantasy Star as a counterpoint to your claim that Phantasy Star II is a game with some of the best graphics of the 16-bit era, which it's not.
12-18-2012, 02:48 PM
Chilly Willy

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

Sprites aren't used for anything but the main character and his weapons on the Amiga on nearly every game except Shadow of the Beast 1, and that one has horrible 3 color sprites. Let's be realistic. You get 7 colors for the foreground that are shared with every enemy since they're blitted, not sprites. See Agony, Jim Power, Wolfchild, Kid Chaos, Lionheart and Mr. Nutz for examples.

What I don't get is why no game uses two simple 3-color sprites repeated to make the background. A bit static sure but at least you'd still have 5-6 sprites remaining for the main character and UI/Weapons, plus a 16/32 color foreground (32 if using EHB).

The Amiga was really underused.

And you keep assuming I don't know I'm talking about, this is around the 4th time you've done it, really I'd think you'd have learned by now.

No, I keep questioning your amibiguous statements, forcing you to actually explain yourself rather than making vague hand-waving statements that very few people comprehend. ;)

I'm gradually trying to make you into someone who makes good posts from the start. Look at the post I quoted and then this one... which one is the better post? :D
12-18-2012, 03:34 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chilly Willy

I'm gradually trying to make you into someone who makes good posts from the start. Look at the post I quoted and then this one... which one is the better post? :D

Well, can't argue with that, but still, I make vague hand-waving statements because not everyone here is a programmer. It was a comment on what was common then (games whose foregrounds, including enemies, only had 7 colors), not hardware capability.
I'll try to be more specific from now on.
12-18-2012, 03:40 PM
Thenewguy

Quote:

Originally Posted by StarMist

@ Kamahl/Thenewguy: what's the name of the background effect in that Brian the Lion gif?

I hereby name it "person-trapped-inside-a-spinning-tube effect"
12-18-2012, 03:49 PM
Kamahl

I just call it a tunnel effect. It was done on Super Castlevania 4 too using mode-7. On the PC Engine Metamor Jupiter does it but differently (it's all skewed to one side). On the genesis you have it in Batman and Robin and Ranger X, but there's no vertical motion.
12-18-2012, 03:50 PM
sheath

It's line scrolling as far as I know.
12-18-2012, 03:53 PM
Thenewguy

I think Psygnosis & Reflections were definitely aiming at Castlevania 4 with that section, its basically doing the game's two most impressive looking effects simultaneously, and with less slowdown (the background on SCIV does look much more detailed though).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kamahl

I just call it a tunnel effect.

What about "rotating tunnel effect"
12-18-2012, 03:56 PM
Kamahl

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheath

It's line scrolling as far as I know.

Nah the vertical movement would ruin it if it was. Basically on the genesis it's done using linescrolling but the image is pre-drawn distorted as a tunnel. As such, it can't have vertical movement. The Amiga one is done by changing the horizontal position of the background while it's being drawn onscreen using the copper. Extremely complex trick.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thenewguy

What about "rotating tunnel effect"

Yeah that's a better name to distinguish it from the genesis tunnel effect (which is more limited).
12-18-2012, 05:11 PM
magicalsoundshower

I'm currently skipping through a longplay of Brian the Lion actually looks like one of the best combinations of neat effects and consistently decent looks (save for the somewhat crappy-looking basses, another Amiga staple) available on the Amiga, which is something that is really rare on the system. Guess you really have to give Reflections props. It's pretty amazing that none of the reviews I came across back then mentioned the really freaking stunning effects the game had to offer. Guess they probably didn't play all that much of it before they wrote the review. ;)

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