The thing that blew my mind in Zero Tolerance was the blood splattering on the walls, really. That was so cool.Quote:
Zero tolerance, even if you don't see it up close, it leaves behind bloody corpses.
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The thing that blew my mind in Zero Tolerance was the blood splattering on the walls, really. That was so cool.Quote:
Zero tolerance, even if you don't see it up close, it leaves behind bloody corpses.
Yep, blast an infected soldier with the shotgun at close range and the blood splatters on the wall behind him and then slowly drips down to the floor. It was such a cool effect!Quote:
Originally Posted by Obviously
I love how Zero Tolerance has effects that are not present in Doom 32x: ZT has those blood spatters, plus shooting damage onto the walls, plus the ability to jump. Amazing for the limited hardware.
I like how you can shoot the same guy and keep running after him, and if u keep shooting, he'll keep flying back without ever falling down to the ground. You can make a guy fly back across a whole stage if you do that lol.
As for this thread: Clearly the OP was talking about modern-day collecting prices and he probably never expected the thread to blow up so much lol.
Re: SNES being more kid-friendly: Well it was. Everyone knew that.
Also you have to think about poor kids (like me) who had limited games. SNES came with Mario World with childish, cartoon graphics. Genesis came with Sonic, & graphics are way more "mature" even though it sounds funny to say that.
As a poor kid in the 90's, my console came with Sonic 1 & 2 (both destroying MW visually & in gameplay), and I randomly bought a used Storm Lord (naked women fairies and evil skeletons in a boring game of collecting items). There was no comparison to going to a friend's and playing MW with cartoon graphics!!
Since this thread is about the Mega Drive / Genesis being better than SNES my take on this is that it definetly owns in the following areas
- faster gameplay ('blast processing';) ) - in general the MD can do more sprites on screen - with SNES its either slowdown (Super Ghouls and Ghosts, UN Squadron) or a limitation on the number of opponents on screen (e.g. Final Fight with just 3 opponents vs countless opponents in Streets of Rage)
- higher actual in game resolution - compare games such as Desert Strike on both systems, in this regard the SNES was a paper spec queen
- better ports of home computer titles (from Amiga or Atari ST)
- more 'mature' games (in terms of subject matter, gore, religious imagery etc.)
- better RGB output - a bit debatable but generally SNES is regarded to have more blurry visuals; some argue its the way Nintendo intended things to be to smooth out the graphics
- the 'cooler' system - I think it was the combination of the more mature titles, classic Sega arcade franchises and the sports games, backed by notable sport personalities. More often than not it was the SNES owners that secretly looked on with envy / admiration at the Genesis / Mega Drive than the other way round.
This comes from the owner of a SNES back when the 16-bit wars were in full swing and currently the owner of both systems.
A very good addition to the discussion – I especially like the point you made which is often omitted concerning 'mature' game concepts. A lot of the focus is on blood and gore, but somehow I can not see games portraying illegal, dangerous and unsporting behavior such as Road Rash or Skitchin being given the green light by Nintendo.Quote:
Originally Posted by midnightrider
One game, which I feel kind of slipped the Nintendo censorship net was Super Smash TV on SNES - very violent, very bloody and with a subject matter that could hardly be considered as childish, yet somehow it got released as an official Nintendo endorsed title. What I find interesting about this game also is that it features a high number of sprites on screen but no flicker or slowdown - goes to show that with proper programming one can overcome a lot of the supposed hardware limitations of a given system.
The SNES can actually handle a good load of small sprites. If they were as big and detailed as Final Fight, it would be a whole other story.
Super Smash TV has 2 aspects that need to be considered though. 1st, that it was also released on the Genesis, and 2nd, that it wasn't one of either consoles big sellers. 2 major things that wouldn't have changed the general perception of the consoles.
Yeah, if I recall from other posts, the SNES actually can handle more sprites than the Genesis in absolute numbers, no matter the size (128 on the SNES vs. 80 on the Genesis). The main difference is that the SNES's sprite hardware isn't as flexible as that in the Genesis. While the SNES can handle up to 128 sprites, you can only have one or two different supported sprite sizes on screen at one time whereas the Genesis lets you mix and match all of its supported sprite sizes until you hit the overall limit of 80. This could result in a case where you have to use up your sprite budget on lots of smaller sprites to make up "composite sprites" (for lack of a better term) whereas those same "composite sprites" could consist of a mix of small, medium, and large sprites as appropriate and therefore use up a smaller part of the sprite budget.Quote:
Originally Posted by midnightrider
Separate from sprite-per-line limit issues, the SNES starts to chug when there is too much going on. Many games seemed to limit the number of objects flying around to avoid that, while other games which seem very well polished, still slow right down when there is a decent number of sprites flying around. When you do see a decent number or size of sprites, they tend to all be the same size. Between the two bottlenecks, it makes the SNES functionally much poorer for sprite display than MD and PCE. But at least one of those bottlenecks can be countered by accelerator chips.
On the SNES, Street Fighter II: Turbo [and I think the others SF2 games] when you defeat an opponent, or an opponent defeats you the game comes to a crawl, even to the point theres about a 1 second pause. It's no anywhere near that bad in Street Fighter II: Championship Edition for the Sega Genesis.
That's an aesthetic choice, the arcade had slowdown as well after you finish off your opponent.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaniyth
Also I just compared the Arcade/Snes/Genesis versions and all versions go into slomo after finishing an opponent.
There's really no version that had it worse.
SNES Super Smash TV, Turbo Mode
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1E5HUYbbyA4
I've always wondered how it is that so many people imagine this kind of stuff. I guess it's just fanboy goggles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaniyth
But in faster speeds you can see the aesthetic/cinematic slowdown increase in speed proportionately and it makes absolutely no sense for a game to chug only when the least amount of action is occurring. :p
The SNES version does have a split second pause (few people notice it), but it also prepares to play an exclusive crowd sound and both the SNES and Genesis versions don't fade out the music faithfully. Does that make the PC Engine a powerhouse in comparison?
I think a lot of people just don't realize that SFII had slow-down on purpose. I wouldn't really criticize anyone for misunderstanding it though. It must be the only game I can think of that has intentional slow-down lol. Easy to get the wrong impression, I guess.
Actually there's a moment of slow-down (on purpose) every time you hit the opponent. It makes it more dramatic. It's one awesome part of SFII. :cool:
The modern CAVE bullet hell games like Mushihimesama and the DoDonPachis all have intentional slowdown on the original arcade PCBs that is difficult to emulate on the home ports. The PS2 Mushi lacks a lot apparently, which of course makes a difficult game that much harder and also make comparing scores between platforms irrelevant.
The later 360 ports are apparently pretty accurate, though not perfect on this front. There are allegedly some reviews on the internet that mark the games down on account of this deliberate slowdown.
+1Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoVamp
Its not really slowdown but slow motion to make things more dramatic.
Also the arcade versions have a lot of intentional slowdown programmed in e.g. when you execute a fierce kich / punch to your opponent - in the absence of blood its supposed to better reflect the power of the hit / damage taken.