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what post? what were you saying?Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickSciFi
As for Sensible Soccer, this is what Sega Retro says about International Edition:
The game was marked as a limited edition release, and features teams, groups, and players from the 1994 FIFA World Cup. It is otherwise almost exactly the same game, right down to the menus.
We are really in the limit but let's count it as a separate game
Thoughts on the lists:
* I also think MBM and PP1 are different enough to be counted separately. MBM cuts out everything of the tutorial stages and then altered some of the patterns (notably how Draco has Skeleton-T’s pattern) and visual effects, in addition to the total redraw, alterations to the sound driver, mostly different soundtrack, and completely different storyline.
* I personally feel like the Wisdom Tree games moreso belong in the same camp of the Taiwanese bootlegs. Action 52 as well. Given that these developers were small, shady, and NEVER received a permit from Sega...
* Tectoy/AtGames/Devworks shovelware originals might merit a list. They do seem to work in Kega Fusion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ix0...ature=youtu.be
I'm glad to see someone put something like this together. Puts some perspective on the scale of the library.
to complex things a bit more:
do you count region optimized games as different games? for example 50hz optimized Sonic 3
I don’t think those are distinct enough. Less so than Turma de Monica, or maybe even certain rom revisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by chameleon
I know this is an old post but:
Fun this is brought up, since it turns out Mega Anser may run into muddly territory (OK, that's kind of a stretch, but...). See, it's home banking software, but if you try to run it with the keypad plugged in but not the modem, it enters "simulation mode" and lets you toy with it with fake bank accounts (presumably for training?), down to occasionally faking connection errors. So in some sense it's sorta like a game too.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
updated OP to reflect miru & Sik's observations.
Tectoy/AtGames shovelware originals might merit a list. They do seem to work in Kega Fusion.
Also more light (& list) on this please, as I thought they run on a different cpu (that emulates the MD's for the original games). Are they, well, licensed by Sega?
They are all licensed by Sega, Under TecToy. They are TMSS-compliant (as seen when I ran some of the ROM files found by someone else here), and seem to have been designed under license by TecToy and Sega by Devworks.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
Here are some examples of the shovelware originals:
* Adventure in the Park
* Air Hockey
* Black Sheep
* Bomber (I heard this one was released on a cartridge very late in the genesis lifespan)
* Bulls And Cows
* Chess
* Color Puzzle
* Cross the road
* Curling 2010
* Fight And Lose
* Jack’s Pea
* Jewel Magic
* Pense Bem
* Spider
* Snoring Triceratops
* Whack A Wolf
Also:
cartridge?
EDIT:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Ix0FAjkpx8&feature=youtu.be
Video footage of one of the Devworks games running in Kega Fusion.
Jesus, this is worst than the worst homebrew early efforts/tests etc.
a 2005 MD game that is licensed by Sega? Really? Are those roms somewhere so I can test them on real hardware?
http://www.mediafire.com/file/31j8fy...ff/ahockey.binQuote:
Originally Posted by chilled
And i’m not sure if Sega approved them, but the TMSS compliance might suggest something, and TecToy (Who was licensed by Sega as their distributor) did approve them.
That music is...something else.Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
Miracle Piano Teaching System contains a number of mini-games, which gives it a little more footing. Any plans for a list of non-game software in general?
Those devworks games developed for the Tectoy's 2000s Mega Drive models (Super Mega Drive 3 43 games till the Mega Drive 4) was never released in cartridge format only built in the flash memory of these consoles. Esrael (from the Sonic 2 scene) and some other guys dumped the Flash memory of the Mega Drive 4 (the worst Tectoy Model by far)Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
I compressed these exclusive devworks games.
Here's the download link:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/9du7z9laof...0dump.zip?dl=0
SOURCE: https://tabajara-labs.blogspot.com.b...4-parte-1.html
Thus far the list seems fine! I think you all made valid points. If I find something else, I'll notify you for sure. Fun fact - according to what I checked, only about 120-130 officially released games were not localized into English. Of those, quite a few received fan translations (between 30-40). Either way, that's about 120-130 as opposed to about 1000-1100 (!!!) for the SNES. :daze:
So yeah, these merit a list of their own. What about games that were only ever part of compilations?Quote:
Originally Posted by LinkueiBR
Now that you mention it, I think some of the Sega Game Library games were only rereleased on the Dreamcast compilation (i.e. not in the Sega CD release of Game No Kanzume). Thinking about the pool game here (it wasn't rereleased on Sega Channel either).
I'm trying to find a way to NOT include those games in the complete officially licensed games released for the MD/G.
Please help me.
My main argument as of now is that they are aftermerket games, mostly released on emulation hardware, even if they could theoretically run on real hardware. Also had Sega showed any interest in this, they would probably NOT have licensed this software
Noticed that John Madden Football '93: Championship Edition is missing (then again I just found out about that one a couple of days ago...). Seems to have been first a rental exclusive and later released as mail-order only (never in stores per-se). Not sure what the exact differences against vanilla '93 are (title screen is obviously different), but it does seem it has some updates.
Also correction:
There's actually an off-line mode (although again, 2P only).Quote:
900. San San (2P only game and only playable via modem)
Just keep them off the main list and put them in their own list (or add a note). Simple as that.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
And is "The Great Earthworm Jim Race" valid for this list?
Updated OP, thanks Sik. Where's that offline mode? Couldn't find it myself in the japanese menu...
I'm hesitant with The Great EWJ Race.
Will include Tectoy games in a different list in the OP. Is there more info or a complete list somewhere? Ideally with year of release
I'd need to recheck (long ago since I last ran it)Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
but I think it was the third option?it's the second option, then fourth option. You get an empty board in this mode and then you can place pieces taking turns (note that both players share the controller).
I believe San San refuses to start a game until you initialized memory though, even in off-line mode for some dumb reason (to initialize memory you need to go to the fourth option, then second, then first). So you need to take care of that before you can play.
San San also seems to have some messaging system for some reason. Also it can get full (just by writing messages yourself, no need to send anything) and make the game crash -_-
EDIT: off-line mode
https://i.imgur.com/MRfVk3x.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/7omDGho.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/rLfIiUr.png
And if you ever need to clear memory:
https://i.imgur.com/Weg2X3S.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/rNvk25o.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/i5ipkiP.pnghttps://i.imgur.com/JKshry5.png
Would Blockbuster World Video Game Championship II be a distinct game, or just a compilation? In BWVGCII, you play a round of each of the two games to obtain a point score.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
Oh and here's my answer the EWJ dilemma... thanks for mentioning BWVGCII as I'd never consider it a distinct game from NBA Jam and Judge Dredd. Having a point system/competition added with almost no additional screens doesn't make them different games. I'd like to keep the spirit of this list centered around how many games zere released in total. Software marketed as games and vice versa are headache inducing enough...Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
I found out about at least five undumped Sega Game Toshokan games, to join the six undumped Sega Channel ones (plus some software)
http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.p...0&#entry919036
The short-lived Japanese Sega Channel adds two more to that list (that have actually been dumped!), plus one more US Sega channel game that disappeared:Quote:
Kinetic Connection ① Nei Second (きねちっく★こねくしょん①ネイ・セカンド) [Puzzle] , 1991
Kinetic Connection ② O hanaba take (きねちっく★こねくしょん②お花ばたけ) [Puzzle], 1991
Kinetic Connection ③ Shirogane wa warau yo (きねちっく★こねくしょん③白銀は笑うよ) [Puzzle] , 1991
Kinetic Connection ④ Mogura no o asobi (きねちっく★こねくしょん④モグラのお遊び) [Puzzle], 1991
Kinetic Connection ⑤ Lightning Nei (きねちっく★こねくしょん⑤ライトニング・ネイ) [Puzzle], 1991
Pyramid Magic Yokokuhen (Trailer) (ピラミッドマジック予告編) [Puzzle], 1990
Pyramid Magic Editor (ピラミッドマジック・エディタ) [Puzzle], 1991
Pyramid Magic Sōshūhen (Summary) (ピラミッドマジック総集編) [Puzzle], 1992
Sega Music Collection Phantasy Star Ⅲ (セガ・ミュージックコレクション ファンタシースターⅢ) [Other], 1991
Sega Music Collection Bonanza Brothers (セガ・ミュージックコレクション ボナンザブラザーズ) [Other], 1991
Sega Music Collection Sonic the Hedgehog (セガ・ミュージックコレクション ソニック・ザ・ヘッジホッグ) [Other], 1991
Taiketsu! Columns (対決！こらむす) [Puzzle], 1991
Planet Message Quiz
Nyuushi Chokuzen Check Nanmon Kimon Kiki Kaikai
Berenstain Bears' A School Day (Pico game running on Genesis hardwares?)
http://forums.sonicretro.org/index.p...c=25935&st=255
Seems like Sega was doing the same thing that was done with Chrono Trigger on BS-X.Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
Worth noting that the games we already have aren't even proper dumps, they come from some Japan-only compilation that included emulated versions of all games but the games were modified to play nice with the emulator (also they're all appended to the base Toshokan ROM, which not only was modified to boot straight into the games but also itself sees minor changes across each game, e.g. sometimes the 68000 vectors are different).
Odd choice but I guess the Pico couldn't access Sega Channel ;P Still kind of odd that they'd put it up for preview there.Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
Porting a Pico game to MD shouldn't be that hard if you have the source code though (assuming it's not utter trash). The ADPCM chip from the Pico is missing on the MD, but on the other hand the MD has the Z80 and YM2612 (which the Pico doesn't) so they could be given the task to play speech. ROM, RAM and VDP are exactly the same so no need to mess with those. Then after that it essentially boils down to adapting the controls.
I was thinking that those were sound-test things, but an alternate OST to Sonic 1 that's been long-lost is intriguing enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sik
Well, the Chrono Trigger one I mentioned is literally a sound test (no new tracks aside from those that were already in the game but unused), so I wouldn't be surprised if this is different. Although it seems kind of pointless for Sonic 1 since it had a sound test readily available (sure, behind a cheat code, but it was pretty well known by then and accessible immediately from the title screen).
I wonder why Magical Hat (Japanese) is the default for it and Decap Attack (world) while it’s vice versa for Puyo? And Outback Joey is undumped, much like the missing Channel and Toshokan games.
no reason: I just counted Robotnik first and the debate on whether Puyo 1 is a distinct game came after the 900+ game numbering (on alphabetical order). Outback Joey is not the only undumped game on the list. Being released on cart or being dumped is not a requirement to be on this list. Being game-ish is, though, so thee music collections are not making it.Quote:
Originally Posted by miru
As for the Tectoy 40-in-1 games, at least two of them are russian pirates/homebrews I already had played (Chess and Bomber, which look to be the best by far) but we'll consider them as licensed I guess...
I updated OP to reflect those contributions, thanks. Now it's more like 925 games (968 if you count 3 doubious Pyramid Magic roms and the 40 Devwokrs/Tectoy crappy flash ports).
You’re welcome! And what I meant to say is that it is odd that Outback Joey is not mentioned to be undumped unlike the missing downloadable games.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
oh right, I missed this. Done and slightly updated OP
Updated OP to reflect new licensed games and some I had missed. Now 929.
EDIT: as requested, I'm adding Tec Toy's shovelware games, listed. But not the ones that required additional hardware CPU (Java), only the mobile ports that do work on original hardware + emus + flashcarts. They were released as pack-ins either on Mega Drive 3 or 4, though some of them are Master System games, but I'm counting them as they were released for the system, just as Phantasy Star I on a japanese MD cart at the time.
Couple things I found:
1) You seem to be missing F1 (NA: Formula One) - SegaRetro page
2) I think these two are duplicates:
234. F1 World Championship
235. F1 World Championship Edition
3) I think "Fire Pro Wrestling Gaiden" (255) is a mistake; there was a "Fire Pro Gaiden" on the Saturn (SegaRetro), but the Mega Drive entry from this series is "Thunder Pro Wrestling Retsuden" (which isn't on your list): SegaRetro and Wiki pages
4) This one's a nitpick, but if you're using NA releases as first priority (over EU/JP/etc), the NA release of "The Legend of Galahad" (378) is just called "Galahad"
1) F1 is there on 234. but you are right, it's just called F1, I think I inherited the World Championship moniker from a No-Intro/GoodGen incorrect naming (which happens a lot).Quote:
Originally Posted by billybob884
2) F1 WCE is its sequel but was not released in the US and is probably the best F1 game on the system; it's a shame it is not well known (as most non-Genesis non-shooter games). There's not even a review on the site.
3) You're right, I just kept the name under which the series is known for, but was refering to Thunder... obviously. Fixing it
4) updated, thanks. Anyway correct naming is not the main priority here, just a name which is recognizable for most.
Hi again, I found a few more things:
1) "Rainbow Islands: The Story of Bubble Bobble 2" [594] is a Master System game; the sequel "Rainbow Islands Extra" (which isn't on your list) is the Mega Drive entry for the series. [Segaretro]
2) You have "San San" listed twice [632] & [900]
3) I didn't see Chavez II listed, was that a miss or on purpose due to it being a rebranding of Boxing Legends of the Ring [90]? Given some of your other inclusions, you should probably add this as well (John Madden '93 [395] & Championship edition [917] as separate games, both versions of Klax [901 & 369], both versions of Marble Madness [408 & 902], Poyo Poyo [916] & Mean Bean Machine [195], and Super League 91 [725] & MLBPA Sports Talk Baseball [675] )
4) For "High School Soccer - Kunio Kun" [308], I couldn't find this exact title anywhere, is this the same as "Nekketsu Kouko Dodgeball Bu: Soccer Hen MD" ? [Segaretro]
5) Another one with a mismatching title, "Mamono Hunter Yohko - Makai Kara no Tenkosei" [406]. [Segaretro] , [Wiki]
Also, regarding your comment on Outback Joey: "game that apparently can be played without the accessory",
Does this mean your list's qualification is a game must be playable without accessories (other than a standard 3/6 button controller)? Because that's not the case for a few titles (OBJ, Miracle Piano, and Menacer, to name a few)
Thanks for improving this!Quote:
Originally Posted by billybob884
1) & 4) & 5) just a name correction, done
2) damn, I'm leaving 632 and will re-number the last ones at a later time
3) I won't consider them separate games (see Elitserien, Mario Basler , etc. though I reckon you point at those difficult cases. Anyway Marble Madness & Klax were programmed by different companies and show big differences in them. Same for Puyo & Robotnik, Decap Attack, etc. Let me look a bit more into the 2 sports games clashes you mention.
As for OBJ, someone said it can be played with stock joypad. What games on the list would not be playable ?
Down to 928 games
EDIT: Baseball games: I'm following Sega Retro most if not all the time. Music is replaced by commentary, which makes the game quite different, that's why I listed both. Madden: Sega Retro lists them separately and this very site published distinct reviews for each one. The update on 93 C.E. is rooster (classic teams, proper colors) and increased difficulty so I consider it almost as the same level of update between 97-98 iteration's of the sports games on the system.
Source:
http://www.rfgeneration.com/blogs/re...Games-2854.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_M...Football_%2793
and that Joe Redifer's comment which I won't dare to contradict ;)
Yea, I guess Chavez makes sense comparing to Elitserien.Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
Klax I'll begrudgingly give you due to the multiplayer and gameplay settings differences, but for Marble Madness "big differences" is a stretch; I get they're by different companies, but really all that's different is the title card, some colors, and I think they use different sound drivers. The gameplay feels the same, and level layouts/enemy placement all appear identical (at least for the first few levels, didn't 100% both games to check). Your list though, up to you.
So again, this raises the question of whether you want to require a game to be playable with a standard 3/6 button controller in addition to other optional peripherals:Quote:
Originally Posted by chilled
1) Outback Joey (898) - This is not playable with a standard 3/6 button controller, and won't actually boot at all without the "processor" peripheral/controller plugged into port 1. You can, however, play OBJ (with the processor/controller peripheral) on any standard model 1/2/3 NTSC-US Genesis (not sure about NTSC-JP or PAL Mega Drives); internally, the heartbeat console it comes with is just a standard model 1 Genesis, rebranded with a fancy new shell.
2) Menacer 6-in-1 (905) - This will boot without the gun/receiver plugged in, but you can't navigate the menus or actually play any of the games with a standard controller (unlike Lethal Enforcers or other Justifier-compatible games).
3) Miracle Piano (897) - Similar to the above, this will boot without the piano controller plugged in, and actually requires a standard controller to navigate the menus, but you need the piano to actually play any of the mini-games.
I thought there was a fourth item, but I apparently didn't write it down (d'oh!) and I can't spot it off-hand; I'll reply back if I remember it.
Notable though, is that they're all Sega-licensed products, and (arguably) all games, so I'd hate to exclude them based on just the controller requirements alone; personally I'd recommend just specifying that a game must play on a standard Sega console without the use of the CD or 32X accessory, irregardless of control mechanism, but again, your list.
Dunno if the one you're thinking on, but Mega Anser doesn't support the controller at all either (it requires the Ten Key Pad). Technically not a game, but it's in the list because running with keypad but no modem puts it in some sort of simulation mode with fake money (so if you're really bored…)Quote:
Originally Posted by billybob884
updated with those notes. I guess it's not that important to not require an accessory so I'll leave them in. After all, the whole idea of this list is knowing how many games were made for the system (which I couldn't find anywhere in a list form), and exploring those fringe cases is always interesting, that's why I added them in a somewhat grouped way.
EDIT: Also I'm feeling like I should separate the 2 arcade compilations (Williams and, as those were real games developped separately (ports), unlike fun'n'games, Menacer 6-in-1, Wacky worlds, etc which are just mini-games sold as one game (just as with Olympic games carts, multi-sport game as ACME all-stars, Acquatic games...), what do you think ? My main issue with listing games like Joust is that they weren't released separately. Same thing occurs with Tectoy shovelware, but even with downloadable-only games for that matter. I'm redoing the list in order to do so, we'll see how it goes
EDIT2: done. Up to 934 games, reordered to get a main list of 900 games and listing the most difficult cases at the beguinning. List is easier to navigate and reordered taking into account latest posts on this thread. Also added for info some carts that were debated in here but not added (not games)
No, I don't think it was Mega Anser I was thinking of, but that's another good controller example (though I'm skeptical it should be considered a game). I'm probably mistaken and it was only those three I found... thanks for the suggestion, though. Does anyone know of any video of it in action? I found a video of the (presumably non-interactive) demo loop (YT), but I'd be curious to see what this "simulation mode" actually is. Really though, it's just so bizarre that there were not just one, but several banking programs for the MD... what the hell was going on in Japan that parents found the need to use their kid's Sega to check their bank accounts? :shock:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sik
Question on the handful of physically released TecToy games though, do we know for sure that any of them were actually licensed through Sega? All I've been able to find out about Sega/TecToy's partnership was that Tec Toy was to be the distributor for Sega's products, no word on whether they were licensed to actually produce their own games.
Also on a side note, did any of the games in the "37 TecToy games" list have physical releases? Best I can figure is they're digital-only pack-ins on TecToy's "console-on-a-chip" dealies (MS Evolution and/or MD 3/4).