Real hardware worth all the cost?

Read the last sentence at the bottom if you don't want to read my whole post:

I used to be settled with my softmodded Wii for all my retro gaming needs, but I can't help but still like playing on the real hardware. Emulation does have it's place though, such as being able to play all retro consoles and their games out of just one piece of hardware, being able to save state, have upscaled video on HDMI and/or component YPbPr for consoles that only output composite or even RF at best.

Real hardware is very pricey though. Having real Genesis is one of the cheapest and easiest to use for modern TVs since it doesn't require any modding. Playing old games on their real consoles IMO has a certain distinct feel to it that you can't really get out of emulation. It's kind of like audiophiles with vinyl records I suppose. Some games just can't run properly or run slower in emulation actually, particularly Super FX games and N64 games.

So does anyone feel that the investment of a lot of hard earned money into real consoles is worth it compared to the really small cost of just emulating everything?

Yes it's worth it, if you want to play the games with pure 100% accuracy. Emulators of today are still just a rough approximation, they can't be exact. If they were 1:1 transistor accurate, they would run so slow they wouldn't appear to work. Even if, for the most part, an emulated game may work 100% identically, the inner workings and background processes won't be identical. That bothers me enough to say that emulation is inferior today, maybe tomorrow too. Is emulation a good option? Yes it can be, just so long as it's not a crummy emulator box like those AtGames clones. A Wii or Xbox is a much better alternative.

The other nice advantage to real hardware is every game being on its own cartridge, the controllers, the having the console itself and all the amusing little things that come with owning 20 - 30 year old hardware. It's not so bad when you can make the hobby pay for itself, either by reselling or modding/reproing.

Short answer? No.

Long answer? Nope.

I used to have a lot of video game hardware because I was (1) young and stupid, (2) downloading a ROM over dialup would take a month.

Hardware is aging. Tinkering is fun but a Genesis is not a '69 Camaro. I sold off/donated almost all my old hardware in the last few years except for a few like my CDX, Saturn and Dreamcast. I keep them in the closet and they come out once every 1.5 years probably.

That said, emulation still isn't dead on accurate. Some PSX games still don't run accurately in EPSXE or on a PS3 for that matter. Game Gear games run just like they did on the old hazy screen.

Where do you draw the line? A later revision PS2 emulates some PS1 functions through the EE and others are routed through the legacy PSX CPU. What is that? How about a GBA playing GB games?

That said, top of the line '90s hardware still hasn't been emulated 100%. I don't use emulators. Input lag is a problem as well. A $50 piece of plastic or 15-year-old ROM chips though? I'll try it in an emulator.

I got into the emulation scene around 1999 or 2000. I remember Bleem making waves. I also remember what reputation you earn when your friends see you put a PSX CD into a PC in 2002 or something. My dad tried to 'confirm' my claims of figuring out a way to play PSX games on the PC with the salesgirl, since I didn't have a PSX but wanted Spyro: Ripto's Rage. The girl at KB Toys said 'no, sir.' And that was that.

I wonder about the current/last generation. Will we be able to play PS3 games in 20 years?

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Originally Posted by Guntz

Yes it's worth it, if you want to play the games with pure 100% accuracy. Emulators of today are still just a rough approximation, they can't be exact. If they were 1:1 transistor accurate, they would run so slow they wouldn't appear to work.

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Yeah true, the weird thing is what got me into getting the real Genesis hardware recently. It was because of the Wolfenstein 3D port. I was extremely curious as to how it ran on actual hardware compared to an emulator. On emulators it does run better, but I like playing it on real hardware just because I'm more amazed by it when I'm playing it on an actual Genesis, and it still runs great. It just so happened that a co-worker of mine gave me his old Genesis for free too.

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Originally Posted by Guntz

The other nice advantage to real hardware is every game being on its own cartridge, the controllers, the having the console itself and all the amusing little things that come with owning 20 - 30 year old hardware. It's not so bad when you can make the hobby pay for itself, either by reselling or modding/reproing.

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The games being on cartridge doesn't really apply to me but I do see the appeal. I have a few 32X games on cartridge and most especially like having Doom just for the cover art. Having the real Genesis gave me motivation to learn how to solder and do S-Video mods, so that's another positive I suppose. And I did resell a few of them for fair prices with S-Video mods.

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Originally Posted by Blades

Short answer? No.

Long answer? Nope.

I used to have a lot of video game hardware because I was (1) young and stupid, (2) downloading a ROM over dialup would take a month.

Hardware is aging. Tinkering is fun but a Genesis is not a '69 Camaro. I sold off/donated almost all my old hardware in the last few years except for a few like my CDX, Saturn and Dreamcast. I keep them in the closet and they come out once every 1.5 years probably.

That said, emulation still isn't dead on accurate. Some PSX games still don't run accurately in EPSXE or on a PS3 for that matter. Game Gear games run just like they did on the old hazy screen.

Where do you draw the line? A later revision PS2 emulates some PS1 functions through the EE and others are routed through the legacy PSX CPU. What is that? How about a GBA playing GB games?

That said, top of the line '90s hardware still hasn't been emulated 100%. I don't use emulators. Input lag is a problem as well. A $50 piece of plastic or 15-year-old ROM chips though? I'll try it in an emulator.

I got into the emulation scene around 1999 or 2000. I remember Bleem making waves. I also remember what reputation you earn when your friends see you put a PSX CD into a PC in 2002 or something. My dad tried to 'confirm' my claims of figuring out a way to play PSX games on the PC with the salesgirl, since I didn't have a PSX but wanted Spyro: Ripto's Rage. The girl at KB Toys said 'no, sir.' And that was that.

I wonder about the current/last generation. Will we be able to play PS3 games in 20 years?

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Good point, I do find myself going back and forth on whether or not I should keep on going on with real hardware since I have bills racking up. It's the very reason I made this topic, to get everyone's opinion on this. I also find myself drawing the line at PS2 also since PS2 emulation is extremely far from perfect and PS1 emulation isn't too good either. The Wii has the advantage of having great 8-bit and 16-bit emulators (and N64 VC games) along with having a real GameCube built-in, which is also hard to emulate (not that they haven't done a great job with that Dolphin Wii/GCN emulator for PC which also upscales Wii/GCN games to HD resolution).

Thanks for that great reply.

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Originally Posted by Blades

I used to have a lot of video game hardware because I was (1) young and stupid, (2) downloading a ROM over dialup would take a month.

I sold off/donated almost all my old hardware in the last few years except for a few like my CDX, Saturn and Dreamcast. I keep them in the closet and they come out once every 1.5 years probably.

I don't use emulators.

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I'm at a loss on interpreting your post especially in relation to the OP. You had a bunch of old hardware when you were young and stupid, becoming older and wiser you got rid of it except for a few pieces that you rarely break out, and you don't emulate. What do you play?

I am determined to get into real hardware and am working on collecting more and more games. eBay is pretty much written off for me though since the prices are so high, so I visit retro game stores and check craigslist often. Is it worth it? I think it's really just a hobby but there is something satisfying about putting a real game in the system. I don't think its worth paying collector prices, but if you can stick to a budget it's cool.

Its the same reason I like having real CDs instead of mp3s. I think that people are warming back to physical media - there's something nice about having the CD or game on the shelf. People see it, you can talk about it, etc. It's much more obvious what your tastes are when its a.real object not a file.

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Originally Posted by Azathoth

I'm at a loss on interpreting your post especially in relation to the OP. You had a bunch of old hardware when you were young and stupid, becoming older and wiser you got rid of it except for a few pieces that you rarely break out, and you don't emulate. What do you play?

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Nothing really.

My point was emulation is a fine choice, but hardware, though it might play better, has a small marginal return on investment, especially these days.

I don't understand how the OP got that and you didn't.

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Originally Posted by Qjimbo

Its the same reason I like having real CDs instead of mp3s. I think that people are warming back to physical media - there's something nice about having the CD or game on the shelf. People see it, you can talk about it, etc. It's much more obvious what your tastes are when its a.real object not a file.

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When I pay for something, I expect something in return. Copying a file off a server doesn't count.

If it makes a person happy, and not at the expense of their or others well being then it's worth it. I personally could never justify a $450 RGB modded NES. Don't get me wrong it would freaking awesome and there is much worse out there. I watch some of my friends drop thousands on guitars an amps all the time. That I don't get at all. How many damn guitars can a person have? Hot rod guys even more with car parts. I watched one my closest buddies go into debt loosing his girl and daughter in process of restoring a 68 Charger. It also could argued any investment into amusements is a waste. Though I don't think that's quite true since most of us would go crazy without them.

Yeah, input lag is a major issue for me, so real hardware it is.

This is an interesting thread. I just got back into collecting this summer when I found an NES at a flea market for $15. I had about 7 other systems sitting in boxes but for some reason that purchase got me back into collecting and now all of my systems are out on the shelf. since June I bought probably about 30-40 games. Most of them I bought in bulk so I haven't paid that much.

It's like any hobby/passion if you can afford it without missing mortgage payments and it makes you happy on a personal level then why not. Some people I know buy season tickets for a few grand, or old guitars for a few grand, or work on cars/boats. Relative to them my hobby is exceptionally cheaper. I think I've maybe spent $100 on 30 games. But as someone mentioned above, I've been picking up stuff and selling it, getting the money back and using the extra to buy games. In the past two/three weeks alone I got turtles in time, streets of rage 2, hyperstone heist, and some NES games for free by using the profit of reselling stuff I picked up. So right now it's costing me nothing.

I do get the idea of why bother keeping physical games/systems if you can play it somewhere else for free. I have a rec room masters arcade machine in my basement with all of the same games I own physical carts for on it. Even my 5 year old said yesterday when I came home with tmnt Turtles I time "why did you buy this you have it on the arcade?" But it's just something, Maybe it's nostalgia, but I like playing the games the same way I did when I was a kid, and I like holding something, etc. maybe I'm trying to recapture my youth but to me compared to some hobbies it's cheap.

Some days I do feel like an idiot for buying stuff I can get for free but then again you can have that conversation about movies, music, etc. sometimes it's nice to have the actual item especially if you're going to play it and for me, that's the case here.

I also wanted to add, for the $100 and change investment I've made I'm still a lot less invested then if I spent $600 for an Xbox one one extra controller and games. To me if I spend $5 on an nes or genesis game and play it once I've gotten my money's worth already.

Input lag is the major reason to go for the original stuff. If you're playing your consoles on an HD tv, don't.

Emulators all the way personally. I sold off my Megadrive collection not long back and I really don't regret it tbh.

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Originally Posted by Mpavlic1018

This is an interesting thread. I just got back into collecting this summer when I found an NES at a flea market for $15. I had about 7 other systems sitting in boxes but for some reason that purchase got me back into collecting and now all of my systems are out on the shelf. since June I bought probably about 30-40 games. Most of them I bought in bulk so I haven't paid that much.

It's like any hobby/passion if you can afford it without missing mortgage payments and it makes you happy on a personal level then why not. Some people I know buy season tickets for a few grand, or old guitars for a few grand, or work on cars/boats. Relative to them my hobby is exceptionally cheaper. I think I've maybe spent $100 on 30 games. But as someone mentioned above, I've been picking up stuff and selling it, getting the money back and using the extra to buy games. In the past two/three weeks alone I got turtles in time, streets of rage 2, hyperstone heist, and some NES games for free by using the profit of reselling stuff I picked up. So right now it's costing me nothing.

I do get the idea of why bother keeping physical games/systems if you can play it somewhere else for free. I have a rec room masters arcade machine in my basement with all of the same games I own physical carts for on it. Even my 5 year old said yesterday when I came home with tmnt Turtles I time "why did you buy this you have it on the arcade?" But it's just something, Maybe it's nostalgia, but I like playing the games the same way I did when I was a kid, and I like holding something, etc. maybe I'm trying to recapture my youth but to me compared to some hobbies it's cheap.

Some days I do feel like an idiot for buying stuff I can get for free but then again you can have that conversation about movies, music, etc. sometimes it's nice to have the actual item especially if you're going to play it and for me, that's the case here.

I also wanted to add, for the $100 and change investment I've made I'm still a lot less invested then if I spent $600 for an Xbox one one extra controller and games. To me if I spend $5 on an nes or genesis game and play it once I've gotten my money's worth already.

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Yeah I do enjoy buying and collecting old retro consoles as of late, and I have made it into a hobby this past year. In some cases, people I know would just give me their old consoles for dirt cheap or free. I also learnt how to solder out of it so I find that as one positive. As others have mentioned, input lag really gets to me too. I tried playing on an SNES emulator for the PS3 that was set to 1080p and it felt like I was playing a dial up stream service of SNES games because the input lag was so bad.

Disabling V-sync can minimize or even eliminate input lag altogether in emulators but then you have to deal with the dreaded v-sync tear on the screen which I can't bare.

My collecting is a bit different as I only aim to go after the flash carts of each console (if they exist) and then I'm set.

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Originally Posted by Gogogadget

Emulators all the way personally. I sold off my Megadrive collection not long back and I really don't regret it tbh.

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I've had that same mentality on and off for like the last 5-6 years too but then I just keep coming back to getting the real consoles after a while.

In 2014, yes, real hardware is worth it. Real games, not so much, buy Everdrives.