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It's laziness. Connecting a computer to a TV isn't elegant and not playing on a TV ruins it for me. It's possible, but I'd rather just play a port most of the time. A big draw of the arcade machine is the cohesiveness of it all IMO, the cabinet etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
You can use a modded Xbox to run MAME. A potatoe would run those games. I have an old HP computer with a graphics card that has S-Video out. I've been thinking about connecting it to the 32" HD CRT in my man cave. Still, the main attraction of the arcades is the controller interface, and that is where MAME is the way to go, if you're looking for arcade perfect.
While I do like the Colecovision, I do think that the controller is crap, as is the notoriously bad 5200 controller. The ultimate console choice for those arcade ports for me is the PS2, which I have a trackball, arcade sticks and a racing wheel for, and the arcade ports are rock solid.
Fathom controls smoother than other versions. And despite being on more powerful hardware, the ports on Coleco and InTV look drab by comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118
Laser Gates has really distracting light flickering on 800 so I prefer the 2600 version.
TRON Deadly Discs - Not the same experience as the InTV game; it's much faster and not having a keypad gives it completely different controls. And the Aquarius version sucks.
Dodge 'Em is better than Head On (the game it rips off) or any other clones. The original is sluggish compared to the acceleration you get with Dodge 'Em.
Lots of games like Yars' Revenge, Pressure Cooker, Frostbite, Frankenstein's Monster, Solaris, Adventure, Dragonstomper, Rabbit Transit, etc. don't have better versions elsewhere.
Plenty of 2600 games are better on other formats but I like having options to play various versions. Sometimes I feel like playing arcade Q*bert, sometimes VIC-20, sometimes 2600. I didn't grow up with the 2600 port but it has its own charm. Playing Montezuma's Revenge on 2600 gives me a different level layout than on C64.
The colour choices are great for the vast majority of the population's vision. I doubt they ever factored in colour blind players. They might have tested the game in monochrome, but by 1982, black-and-white TVs were on their way out.Quote:
Originally Posted by TrekkiesUnite118
There was literally a switch to select between color and black & white.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater
EDIT (clicked "post reply" too soon by accident): also black & white TVs may have been on their way out but you still want to catter to the small amount of people left with one (it's not like they were completely gone by then) =P Of course by the time the NES arrived to the US a few years later that was probably not a market worth considering anymore (and where colorblind people problems started since nobody cared back then).
I doubt all developers cared to cater to monochrome TVs by that point. While not a 2600 game, Aztec Challenge from 1983, has a level where you can't see the enemies when played in black and white.
I had the four switcher with that nice fake woodgrain back in the early to mid '80s. Edit: Half my time spent on a 9'' BW TV than later half on a 25'' color. But I found it hard to get into the games as a kid and they could only entertain me for 15-30 minutes before I would got bored. They were just to simple and relied to much on imagination for my taste unless they were arcade titles. Back than if I going to use my imagination, I would just go outside and do what used imagination.
That said I do have a junior now and some games (Asteroids, Centipede, Combat, Defender, E.T. The Extra-Terrestrial, Galaxian, Joust, Missile Command, Pac-Man, Ms. Pac-Man, Pitfall!, Q*bert, River Raid, Space Invaders, Starmaster, Video Pinball, Yars' Revenge) but really don't play them enough, 16 bit is just so captivating and awesome... NES too.
Edit: Best 2600 games back in the day Yars' Revenge, Asteroids and Missile Command for me. Never had big seller though Space Invaders back than? Had some of the paddle games but was hard to get others to sit down to play with often.
Trekkies, you're continuing to argue like A Black Falcon, ignoring everyone who says that it's fine that you feel that way, while most here don't, yet still insist that you are right and everyone else is wrong.
Irrationally dismissing all 2600 graphics with the mantra "pixel vommit", just like ABF's relentless use of his catch phrase "hideously pixelated", equally irrationally dismissing all Saturn and Playstation graphics the same way.
You obviously aren't familiar with the better looking 2600 games. It was that generation's Sega Genesis. Even when games weren't as fancy in the pixelart, there were usually cool real time effects that brought them to life and the color gradients were unique for that generation.
2600 visuals are the 2D equivalent of 32-bit 3D graphics. They both have the same range from basic crude visuals all the way up to extremely detailed, with lots of special effects along the way. But there are probably more people who feel that 32-bit 3D is unbearable than 2600 graphics. You have a history of championing 32-bit 3D, yet here you are embracing the same arguments and tactics as the people you regularly argue against at great length.
I could post screenshots and clips of some of the more impressive 2600 games, but you're already so far down the rabbit hole now that there is no longer any point in doing so.
Just agree that you personally cannot appreciate any level of 2600 aesthetics and let the legion of us who do enjoy everything they have to offer.
It was brown objects on a yellow background, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoZeedeater
It's the swimming level with the pirahnas, blue and brown.
True.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
What exactly are you two arguing about? I feel like you're saying the same thing. Is trekkies just saying that 2600 ports are bad? Can't argue against that. Bad ports really are just for nostalgia unless they throw something new into the mix.
You know I played through TMNT (1989) with a friend on an old Dell Latitude P4 with S-video out connected to a huge TV years ago running MAME. I had never finished the game at the arcades when I was a kid. It was awesome and arcade-perfect. Infinitely better experience than any port (which I also tried with the same friend years before that on a Dreamcast running a NES emulator).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades
He was arguing about the 5200 and Colecovision having better arcade ports, but that really isn't the reason why anyone would play those nowadays, considering that MAME exists, along with all of the compilation discs for the Xbox, PS and PS2.
Even I still have a couple of 2600 consoles and a stack of games. Despite its primitive graphics and simple games, I still respect the 2600 and understand why it's been popular for so long. The 2600 just has this unique draw that most other consoles of the period are lacking. Don't forget that the 2600 did also have a lot of original games not based on an arcade game, those were seldom ported elsewhere. I don't think the 2600 version of E.T. or Raiders of the Lost Ark were ever ported.
One thing i've never quite understood is the whole "emulation vs. arcade perfect" thing when it comes to home console ports.
MAME is likely to be a fuck ton more accurate verses a port anyway, and fuck am I paying £70 for Street Fighter 2 on Saturn when I can emulate the damn game to begin with, which is arcade perfect, because it's the arcade version running on an emulator. Is the Saturn version arcade perfect? Maybe, I wouldn't know because it costs a small fortune for a game that is literally on every damn console anyway (and even then, why bother with the Saturn version when you can get Hyper Street Fighter 2 for PS2 or Xbox?)
Also Kaboom is still awesome so whatever
Emulation is often inferior, so I understand the thinking. Good ports don't emulate, they port. Sometimes the port is better than emulation.
At the end of the day it's all software. Lines of code.
Paying for Saturn games?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gogogadget
Phantom Universal
Eh, none of the home ports of Donkey Kong got Mario's footstep sound right, and that was a part of the arcade game that gave it it's charm.
I've noticed that the Saturn version of X-Men vs. Street Fighter and several other Capcom fighters have the edges of the screen cut off.
The Intellivision versions of D2K and D2KSE are arguably the best overall versions of Donkey Kong.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
You can Buy-It-Now with much nicer packaging and performance for $9.99:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gogogadget
http://www.ebay.com/itm/152644729722?redirect=mobile
Or you can buy this version for $30 shipped, which I believe includes Street Fighter Zero 2 Gold and every version of SFII that existed at the time:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/112499538137?redirect=mobile
Saturn games have never been cheaper and they come in nice functional packaging.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades
It's just Super Street Fighter, Super Street Fight Turbo and Alpha 2 Gold in that collection. I have the North American version of that collection.
Early Nintendo arcades (including that one) used analog circuits to generate some of their sounds, which effectively made them out of reach for any port at the time (and later "ports" are more like enhanced remakes instead). Mario Bros is heavily affected by this too.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
That still can't be as bad a situation as some arcades that used mechanical parts for the sounds (e.g. taking a solenoid to hit the cabinet for a crash sound effect). And there's Reactor where the music was made with the resonance of the cabinet in mind - good luck emulating that (#1 reason why MAME still gets the sound wrong for that game).
Mind you, most people prefer arcade versions not for the sake of accuracy but because more often than not ports are worse =P (sluggish physics, trimmed down animations, bugginess in general, etc.)
MAME does Donkey Kong right enough.
From memory, I don't think MAME on the original Xbox could run 3D games that well. Could be wrong, though.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
MAME is entirely software-based, so even a modern 4GHz multicore CPU will struggle with some 3D games from the 90s. Certainly beyond the capabilities of the original Xbox.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Jackal
As is said by MAME devs again and again, the goal of MAME is not to make games playable, but to preserve them as accurately as possible. Playing them is just a positive side-effect. So there's still quite a lot lacking from later 3D games. Thankfully, there are other emulators that cover a lot of those 3D games, like the Model 2 emulator and such.
Ataribox confirmed!
https://kotaku.com/super-rare-atari-...ore-1797394693
Linking to Kotaku should be punishable by being required to write an apology letter.
Super Rare Atari 2700 Found At California Thrift Store
Mike Fahey
Monday, July 31st, 2017 11:00am
According to Redditor L064N, he was shopping at a thrift store in Oceanside, California last week when he came across a very strange Atari console. Some quick Googling told him it was a rare prototype for the Atari 2700, an un-produced wireless follow-up to the 2600. He bought it for $30.
And then he sold it on eBay for $3,000.
Planned for release in 1981, the Atari 2700 was a new iteration of the popular early video game console. Compatible with all Atari 2600 games and accessories, the core difference between the 2700 and its predecessor was a pair of wireless controllers that combined a joystick with a paddle.
continued at:
http://archive.is/ZRiJo
Dear Raijin Z,Quote:
Originally Posted by Raijin Z
I am very sorry for what happened. It was unacceptable and will never happen again. We pride ourselves on our service, and would never do something like that.
Again, I am very sorry for the inconvenience. Please contact customer support for any further concerns you might have – our customer service agents are always very happy to help.
Sincerely,
xelement5x
FWIW, if you want to avoid the pitholes of Saturn imports, you can also get Street Fighter Alpha Collection with all 3 games on PS2, although it's just the arcade versions and missing some shit exclusive to PS1 (avoid) and Saturn (don't avoid I suppose)Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Tiger
Although really, SFA3 Upper (is that what it's even called?) on the PSP is a pretty wonderful port with some extra characters and plays excellently in PPSSPP to boot to avoid the whole portable thing.
Yes, but the discussion wasn't about 90s arcade games. It was about all of the 80s arcade ports on the 2600, 5200 and 7800.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Jackal
Ha, Ha.....No!Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Tiger
The Atari 8-bit ports for their computers and the C64 were still better, and there is now an enhanced 7800 cart that nearly (except the clunky footstep sounds) gets it perfect.
The updated Intellevision version still has Donkey Kong on the wrong side of the girder and elevator levels, and he is still one color. Pauline is one color as well.
Arcade perfect does not equal best.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
How so?
The first version of any game isn't perfect or impossible to improve on. Ports that are as accurate as possible are limited by the source material.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
The arcade versions of Donkey Kong (Japan and Western) are at most probably the 4th or 5th best versions of the game. Here's a comparison of some of the basics of the arcade and Intellivision D2K/SE:
Arcade: Japanese and Western versions play differently.
Intellivision: Both of those modes are included.
Arcade: Virtually arcade perfect!
Intellivision: Faithful base gameplay plus expanand gameplay, positive arcade quirks included, negative game bugs are not.
Arcade: 4 unique stages.
Intellivision: 10 unique stages.
Arcade: Only play as Jumpman
Intellivision: Play as either Mario, Toni or Bruno. Each have different attributes, similar to the different characters in SMB2 USA.
Arcade: Made for arcade cabinets, hi scores lost when unplugged(?)
Intellivision: Video options to improve compatibilty with hdtvs, cartridge keeps hi scores saved always.
Arcade: Misc artificial sounding effects.
Intellivision: Multiple sound/voice samples which can be toggled on/off.
My bad, last time I checked on this thread is when you were talking about Virtua Racing running on your PC. I skimmed through the thread, and put two-and-two together, so yeah, sorry 'bout that.Quote:
Originally Posted by gamevet
You know, silly question: does the quality of the arcade ports even matter regarding the Ataribox? I imagine that whether Atari remained relevant or not matters more, and they pretty much lost all relevance after the console market crash. Atari isn't really remembered much aside from a few early arcade games (many of which have already fell into obscurity, maybe except Asteroids).
Rumor has it Ataribox is a mini Ryzen based PC game console
If that's what you believe. I think that once you take Mario out of the game it is no longer Donkey Kong, but it's a really cool addition to the Intellevision library.Quote:
Originally Posted by Black_Tiger
I heard it was a mini SNES inside a Jaguar case...Quote:
Originally Posted by AlecRob
Oh youQuote:
Originally Posted by Lync
Lol, you got me there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lync
I legit hope the ataribox shakes up the console market. Make things interesting like they were in the 90s... more competition.
That still won't stop Atgames from putting out the same horrible Genesis system time and time again.
But will atgames continue to make Atari products even when Atari Has their own dedicated system?Quote:
Originally Posted by EyeDeeNo76
I wonder if Atari will pull out of their Atgames deal
So huh, turns out the ataribox is literally a low-end PC running Linux:
https://venturebeat.com/2017/09/25/a...-at-least-249/
Possibly important though, it's not locked down, so the implication is that it should be able to run anything Linux:
...well, as long as the game doesn't require too much on the hardware side (it's low-end after all), though they did say they want Minecraft to run on it (and we all know that game isn't exactly the pinnacle of optimization =P).Quote:
Mac said Indiegogo will be able to offer stronger international support for crowdfunding as well as hardware support. As a Linux-based open system, the Ataribox will also promote freedom for users to run what they want. Users will have free access to the underlying OS to customize as they wish.
So huh, this would be a low-end counterpart to a Steambox I guess? (and without the weird controller, albeit they don't say what it'll come with)