Is Tekken Tag Tournament the most impressive looking console game of 2000?

Printable View

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

05-17-2018, 02:27 PM
Yharnamresident

Yea Grandia II has very low poly counts. I played it for a couple hours and never saw it go over 9000 polys a frame. For a 30 FPS game, thats just meh.

Look at those PS1 seams on the walls:

https://i.imgur.com/qhx7hjy.png

Even with 6 characters on-screen it doesn't reach 8000 polys. 7823 x 30 = 230,000 polys per second:

https://i.imgur.com/nsCjxe3.png

https://i.imgur.com/UfXf0Iy.png

Of course there is impressive high-poly stuff in the game. Like look at that stair-set:

https://i.imgur.com/vIik4DF.png

Now compare that to Virtua Tennis 2 hitting 1.6 million polys per second:

https://i.imgur.com/lRigcsN.png

Heres something noteworthy, Grandia II was probably the first JRPG I've played in 16 years. And it is an amazing game. I will be purchasing a disc copy when the time is right.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orchid87

Pretty much every DC to PS2 port is comprimised in one way or another. BTW how does Code Veronica on PS2 compare?

Are you saying I should check that game too?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Andromeda

But Grandia II looks amazing, other than no lip movements for speech its a fantastic looking and sounding game with some incredible mix of real-time and FMV windows for the magical spells. Power Stone isn't using anywhere near the polygons of Tekken Tag, but it looks such a better game and really helped by the incredible textures and wonderfully clean, colourful and vibrant display off Power VR.

The game may be low-poly but it still looks pretty good. Like I love the wall shadows in that second picture I posted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bultje112

are you kidding? f355 on the ps2 looked terrible compared to the dreamcast version and ran in lower fps, no anti aliasing, or very low. worse textures.

ecco also looks better on dreamcast.

This isn't the first time I've seen this guy downplaying Sega consoles.
05-17-2018, 02:28 PM
Blades

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yharnamresident

This isn't the first time I've seen this guy downplaying Sega consoles.

Is this guy me?
05-17-2018, 02:36 PM
Team Andromeda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blades

I think we’ve had this conversation before...lol. Ecco had massive slowdown on DC, any way you slice it.

I'm not denying that . I'm just saying the DC version looks better, better screen Res and the textures and colours looks better and more vibrant and of course the DC version runs at a better Res with support for VGA and I really don't know where you got that F355 doesn't support widescreen on the DC, It doesn't unless one is playing it in VGA mode
05-17-2018, 02:41 PM
Yharnamresident

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blades

Is this guy me?

Yea I remember a couple months ago you were saying the Saturn can't hold a candle against the PS1

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Andromeda

I'm not denying that . I'm just saying the DC version looks better, better screen Res and the textures and colours looks better and more vibrant and of course the DC version runs at a better Res with support for VGA and I really don't know where you got that F355 doesn't support widescreen on the DC, It doesn't unless one is playing it in VGA mode

But it lacks the 3rd-person view which is the real deal breaker
05-17-2018, 02:45 PM
Team Andromeda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yharnamresident

The game may be low-poly but it still looks pretty good. Like I love the wall shadows in that second picture I posted.

Yeah the Game looks nice, features some lovely textures and I love the mix of FMV magic spells with real time GFX, but I was disappointed with the lack of mouth movements and lip synching. I think there were better looking DC games in 2000 myself and I agree its an amazing game .
05-17-2018, 02:46 PM
Team Andromeda

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yharnamresident

But it lacks the 3rd-person view which is the real deal breaker

If you are a casual. The game was a real driving sim and just like in real life you drive from the cockpit, the Arcade game and DC version were real Hard Core.
05-17-2018, 04:26 PM
bultje112

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blades

It didn't run at lower FPS. PS2 F355 had a more complex lighting engine with shadows and ran in widescreen. The textures were slightly worse on PS2.

Ecco is better on PS2 in every way.

this is simply not true. I have these games on both systems and on my dreamcast (with vga) it looks like it's from a different generation. the colors in the dreamcast version are so much better and the anti aliasing is like a generation gap.
05-17-2018, 04:29 PM
bultje112

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Andromeda

Yeah the Game looks nice, features some lovely textures and I love the mix of FMV magic spells with real time GFX, but I was disappointed with the lack of mouth movements and lip synching. I think there were better looking DC games in 2000 myself and I agree its an amazing game .

A really impressive dreamcast game is sakura taisen 4. the 3d graphics are amazing I remember.

check from 2:38
05-17-2018, 06:06 PM
Leynos

PS2 was really poor with textures where DC and Gamecube had really high-resolution ones. Playing PS2 games in HD like DMCHD collection and .hack GU really show how blurry and dark PS2 textures were. DC jad really crips ones and even Grandia II on PS2 looks like shit next to the Dreamcast version.

What the fuck is wrong with that tennis screen? Why is one character huge and one small and clipping through another? That screen is all kinds of fucked.
05-17-2018, 07:10 PM
Silanda

Quote:

Originally Posted by SegataS

What the fuck is wrong with that tennis screen? Why is one character huge and one small and clipping through another? That screen is all kinds of fucked.

ZeroGS is an old and very inaccurate plugin for PCSX2. I'm guessing it's being used because it gives polygon counts, but you wouldn't really want to play games with it these days.
05-17-2018, 07:20 PM
Barone

Quote:

Originally Posted by SegataS

PS2 was really poor with textures

Far superior in terms of multi-texturing when compared to both DC and GameCube.
And it can render them in certain modes that the GC not even supports.

A lot of what I'm seeing here is just a very superficial discussion: pick one single aspect of the hardware and generalize it to the absurd.
The PS2 had less VRAM than the DC and GC. And it also didn't have hardware-support for compression.
Both of these shortcomings can be compensated by how much dynamic use of the hardware and the vector units the programmers were able to do. Games ported from the DC/GC or even PC will usually look like shit if they were originally designed with a more static use of the VRAM in mind (most cases).
05-18-2018, 02:35 AM
Orchid87

The best representation of a console capabilites are the games that were made for those consoles first and foremost. Comparing ports of the same game is a bad idea that leads to wrong conclusions about what console is actually capable of. I mean, PS2 ran Dead or Alive 2 and many other games ported from Dreamcast worse than actual Dreamcast. But could Dreamcast run Tekken Tag Tournament or Gran Turismo 3 as well as PS2? Unlikely.
05-18-2018, 02:55 AM
Yharnamresident

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Andromeda

If you are a casual. The game was a real driving sim and just like in real life you drive from the cockpit, the Arcade game and DC version were real Hard Core.

But the best solution is to have both options

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silanda

ZeroGS is an old and very inaccurate plugin for PCSX2. I'm guessing it's being used because it gives polygon counts, but you wouldn't really want to play games with it these days.

Using a 9 year-old emulator is the price you pay for a poly counter

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barone

Far superior in terms of multi-texturing when compared to both DC and GameCube.
And it can render them in certain modes that the GC not even supports.

A lot of what I'm seen here is just a very superficial discussion: pick one single aspect of the hardware and generalize it to the absurd.
The PS2 had less VRAM than the DC and GC. And it also didn't have hardware-support for compression.
Both of these shortcomings can be compensated by how much dynamic use of the hardware and the vector units the programmers were able to do. Games ported from the DC/GC or even PC will usually look like shit if they were originally designed with a more static use of the VRAM in mind (most cases).

Grandia II could've used some PS2 post-processing effects. Like the campfires are a bunch of triangles, and during battles they could've used some Kratos light beams or whatever they're called.
05-18-2018, 03:06 AM
Leynos

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barone

Far superior in terms of multi-texturing when compared to both DC and GameCube.
And it can render them in certain modes that the GC not even supports.

A lot of what I'm seen here is just a very superficial discussion: pick one single aspect of the hardware and generalize it to the absurd.
The PS2 had less VRAM than the DC and GC. And it also didn't have hardware-support for compression.
Both of these shortcomings can be compensated by how much dynamic use of the hardware and the vector units the programmers were able to do. Games ported from the DC/GC or even PC will usually look like shit if they were originally designed with a more static use of the VRAM in mind (most cases).

PS2 games were always blurry textures. Gamecube had really sharp ones.Download some Sonic 2 texture packs. Work of beauty. Looked great on Gamecube as well. Things were downgraded for PS2 on DC ports and even Sonic Heroes was downgraded. RE4 looked awful on PS2 and use pre-recorded cut scenes. Costumes do not show up. Won't even listen to someone who says PS2 had better textures. Next, you will say N64 had sharp textures. PS2 was a blurry jaggy mess.
05-18-2018, 04:17 AM
Blades

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barone

Far superior in terms of multi-texturing when compared to both DC and GameCube.
And it can render them in certain modes that the GC not even supports.

A lot of what I'm seen here is just a very superficial discussion: pick one single aspect of the hardware and generalize it to the absurd.
The PS2 had less VRAM than the DC and GC. And it also didn't have hardware-support for compression.
Both of these shortcomings can be compensated by how much dynamic use of the hardware and the vector units the programmers were able to do. Games ported from the DC/GC or even PC will usually look like shit if they were originally designed with a more static use of the VRAM in mind (most cases).

This.

Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page