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I concur, they made like 15 Street Fighter and Marvel vs Capcom games between the two systems, along with a bunch of other stuff. And they sure didn't half ass those games, they were arcade-perfect ports. Why didn't they at least try to do that on Genesis!?Quote:
Originally Posted by Aarzak
No, wasn't it ported from the non-Turbo version? Whatever version it was ported from, it should have been the arcade, not the SNES-version. The CPS-1 system is far more similar to the Genesis on all accounts. Same main processor (10 MHz instead of 7.67), same sound processor, soundchip belongs to same Yamaha family. Since the arcade resolution was 384x224 the Genesis version should have used its 320x224 resolution, not the (S)NES resolution !!! Porting from the SNES is just one of the proofs I have for the "Capcom hates the Mega Drive/Genesis" theory. Another one is the fact that the first Champion Edition they sent to Sega for approval was EVEN WORSE and not half-assed, more like 1/100-assed!Quote:
Originally Posted by Aarzak
what about Super Street Fighter II, I remember that game was multiplat as well. Did CAPCOM do a better job with the port for that on Genesis?
No, even worse. Sound isn't good this time, it is horrible. Still the NES resolution. Not as many speeds to used. Uglier boxart. Also, since they didn't use any compression, it takes up a massive 40 MEGA POWER, which caused a massive price as well. Fortunately, that with the fact that people already had SCE which is almost the exact same game except better and minus four characters, people didn't buy all the millions of SSFII carts Capcom made. They lost money on it, which was the exact right thing to happen. They hated the Mega Drive, after all!
They used the low res to save memory. That doesn't mean it's a port of SNES version. Why would they convert the 68k original code to 65816 code, then back to 68k code? That makes no sense. The PCE port also uses the same low res to save memory. If it weren't a problem, they could have used exact sprites/tiles from the arcade without scaling since its mid res mode is almost identical pixel aspect ratio as the arcade. (Genesis 320 mode would still need some resizing)
As for samples, maybe their mixing up to 4 sample channels? Fetching sample data from 4 random access parts of rom from the z80 could have caused the sample playback bottle neck. TmEE's the z80 expert, he should disassemble the z80 driver and see what's going on ;)
A better way to save memory is to use compression.
Low res + compression saves even more memory :D
Yeah, that's another reason why those ports were so cropped........to save memory. I think SFII had many firsts in terms of cart size.....first 16 MEGA POWER cart (SNES SFII: WW), first 20 MEGA POWER cart (SNES SFIIT), first 24 MEGA POWER cart (Genesis SCE), first 32 MEGA POWER cart (SNES SSFII) and first (and only) 40 MEGA POWER cart (Genesis SSFII). It was one of the first games which required lots of memory. That's why they couldn't port over the superior Super Turbo to Genesis/SNES: vanilla SSF2 maxed out the cart sizes already.
And still they could port over Street Fighter Alpha 2 later on to the SNES, which was 32 megs and the original came from the same arcade board (CPS-2) as Super Street Fighter 2 Turbo...?
it only does 2 channels, and very poorly at that... 4KHz samples do not help with the sound quality either...Quote:
Originally Posted by tomaitheous
Sounds like there's some other artifact to the 'voices' than just lower sample rate though. But anyway, doesn't the sound engine have at least 1 software channel for drums and such? Or is it 1 mix channel for drum kit and 1 channel for sample FX (being a priority system)?Quote:
Originally Posted by TmEE
So SF2 CE & Hyper Fighting for the Arcade was programmed in 68K??
Sega Prolly do a better port of CE on the Genesis..I wonder how would it look like
They did so with the S-DD1 compression chip, which heavily compressed the data into a 32 MEGA POWER SNES cart. I still don't know how Nintendo managed to squeeze that one out of Capcom......hell Capcom washed its hands of that project here in the U.S which forced Nintendo to publish SFA2 themselves, as they did with "Mega Man 6" years earlier for the NES. Both were Capcom's last U.S releases for both consoles.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zebbe
The S-DD1 chip wasn't introduced until 1996 with "Star Ocean", so that may have been why no Super Turbo port was made in '94/'95. Plus SSF2 BOMBING in sales in the U.S.
And considering that Capcom could barely if all compress SSF2 on the Genesis, shoehorning it into a 40 MEGA POWER cart, there was no hope whatsoever for any more SF ports, much less CPS2 ports on the Genny. That might've been another factor........the hardware of the then-new CPS2 was more compatible with the SNES (especially sound-wise) than the Genesis, but the CPS2 greatly outclassed both so Capcom & SNK (whose Neo games were way over 100 MEGA POWER by that point) weaned off SNES/Genesis development by the end of 1994, and killed time developing on the 3DO until the PS1 & Saturn came out. Of course they still developed for the SNES well into 1996.........just not SF, but action games. And they threw one last bone at Genesis owners: a disappointing, farmed-out port of "The Punisher".
The other artifacting is caused by extremely uneven playback rate, the sound code is very poor... the PCM code is not as poor as in TecnoSoft sound engine though, but that makes it up with incredible FM handling, and SSF2 driver not...Quote:
Originally Posted by tomaitheous
The game's BGMs do not touch PCM channels at all in case of SSF2...
Capcom had extremely poor code for sound.... the reason Rockman MegaWorld sounds better in all areas is because it uses SMPS (what Sonic games use for example) not Capcoms own shitty engine.
I agree with Zebbe that Capcom never liked MD... only thing they did that's above average is RMMW... though they could have had more optimized C code so there would be less slowdown (which is redicolous).
They had all these kinds of extra chips for the SNES (Mega Man X series for example) but not for Genesis, just some bank switching stuff for SSF2 which doesn't count. They put lowest possible effort when making the MD games, and they just skipped some conversions completely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aarzak