What was the worst video game addon ever! Let us decide!
32x
Sega CD
Xbox 360 HD-DVD player
N64DD
Super Game Boy
Gamecube Gameboy Player
Atari Jaguar CD
Nintendo Satellaview
Natal
Wii-Motion Plus
Printable View
What was the worst video game addon ever! Let us decide!
32x
Sega CD
Xbox 360 HD-DVD player
N64DD
Super Game Boy
Gamecube Gameboy Player
Atari Jaguar CD
Nintendo Satellaview
Natal
Wii-Motion Plus
You're forgetting some things, also Natal isn't out yet...:
Turbografx-16 CD
PS1 DVD Player
Laserdisc Genesis/Sega CD add-on
Laserdisc Turbografx-16 add-on.
Why would the TGCD be considered a failure if the CD format went on to become the dominant format, with much greater number of releases in comparison to its older cart format. It went on to become the main console. IIRC, the OP is referring to failed addons. I.e. which is the worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Baloo
Also, why is the 360 HD-DVD addon on the list? It's not a game extension. It's just for movies. It doesn't fit in the category. Not sure what a PS1 DVD is, but if it's the same - then it also doesn't belong on the list.
Oh, I didn't notice the Xbox HD DVD player! Despite several movies being released in HDDVD format, Blueray was poking it's head from the corner, and ultimately were better in every way, except price!
I am kind of proud to own one of these with a couple movies, I know they'll be worth something to collectors some day.
The PC Engine CD is quite possibly the most successful add-on of all time, if you extend that to the US market, yeah the Turbo CD and duo were weak, but so was the TG-16 in general. NEC's flopped enhancement was their supergrafx -though that's probably tied to the fact that the hardware was never included with the CD units. (didn't it only get something like 2 games made for it?) The CD unit pretty much succeeded the original card format completely.
As with the 360's HDDVD, the MPEG modules for consoles not using it for games (VCDs rather) would be excluded, but I think CDi may have used it for games, and I'm positive Saturn did.
And the Laseractive asn't an add-on, it was it's own console pretty much, the MD/PC Engine expansion modules were the add-ons. ;)
Since Supergrafx isn't really an add-on that wouldn't be included though. (in fact, had it been an add-on -facilitated by the awsome expansion bus- it may have been a good deal more successful, especially if integerated with a CD unit like Sega did -with a much more limited expansion bus at that)
The Jaguar CD came under bad circumstances and also was on the market very shortly with Sam's heart attack and Atari being liquidated in 1996. (in spite of that, some of the best games, if not the best on the system came out on CD exclusively) And with the very limited popularity of the Jaguar, anything was going to be hard to hit. (unless perhaps thay'd managed to get the duo out, but Sony was ruling the market, Nintendo was pusing in and Atari had missed any possible oppertunity to take advantage of Sega's falling from grace -especially in Europe with Atari Corp's reputation tied to the ST there)
Anyway, I'd have to say it's the N64's DD, released late, probably lost nintendo money overall, and sold horribly.
Had it been a propritary CD drived format, that could have been something, but the crappy ZIP-disc knockoff with capacity no better than the largerst cartridge games combined with questionabl reliability (iirc) made it kind of a joke. (less than the capacity of the inital ZIP or SuperDisk) I mean, if they did go with magetic discs, they could at least have used ones with cpacity closer to CDs, both ZIP and SuperDisk had disc capasities rivaling CDs by that time. (superdisk not so much, but still way closer than 64 MB, at 240 MB)
The advantage to nintendo would be greater control over a propritary format -though that could have been possible on an optical disc as they did eventually with the GC -Sega could have too with GD-ROM had it not been for the CD-R flaw; anyway there's also writability (for save data) avoiding memory cards (though since the N64 had them, that's not really an issue), and I think the drive was cheaper than CD, but I'm not sure. (that would be traded with the more expensive media compared to optical discs however) Making them read-only drives might have saved on costs though. (in fact, I think the SuperDisk format allwed common, 1.44 MB floppies to hold 32 MB, but had to re-write the entire disk when modified -not a problem for read-only; obviouslt nintendo wouldn't have used a standard 3.5" compatible disk form factor -probably not even data format)
Well it only lets you do 10 things on the POLL and the Laserdisc Genesis/Sega CD add-on wasn't an ADDON to an original console, it was a console all itself! PS1 DVD player... that sounds good, not much of a failure i would think... And the Natal, well this is all opinion anyways.... what do you think as/will be the biggest "ADDON" failure!Quote:
Originally Posted by Baloo
Just why on earth are the Super Game Boy and Game Boy Player on that list? Or Natal for that matter? Natal isn't even out yet so we don't know if it's gonna be a flop or not.
I'll Agree that it's unfair to call Natal a Flop since it hasn't yet been released/Quote:
Originally Posted by Baloo
As for the TurboGrafx-16 CD while it wasn't huge success in the US it certainly not a failure, and sold very well in Japan where PC Engine where it was very successful and sold better than the SEGA CD.Quote:
Originally Posted by Baloo
The 3 Biggest flops on the list in my opinion in order are: 64DD, Jaguar CD, and Xbox 360 HD DVD
Super Game Boy was in Wikipedia as a "Video Game Console Addon" and I agree it's really not... But that made me think of the Game Boy Player, and it's technically an addon....Quote:
Originally Posted by ApolloBoy
add-on (adon, -ôn)
n.
1. One thing added as a supplement to another.
2. Computer Science
a. See add-in.
b. A hardware device, such as an expansion card, that is added to a computer to increase its capabilities.
3. An additional amount or charge.
Gameboy player definitely "increases (Gamecube's) capabilities"
So don't vote for it! Easy enough....Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse813
I think it might have sold better overall than the original base unit or coregrafx (ie total adoption rate plus duo consoles exceeded the card base units) The deciding factor would of course be the duo sales, but give that the CD format completely superceded the cards and had a much larger library (some released on card only in the US I think) shows that it seems probable that the CD sold better. (or if not, it meant that the remaining card-only users were stuck with a limited library available, but maybe that would make sense for budget consumers)Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse813
The GameCube GameBoy Player was actually a pretty awesome add-on, since it played the entire GameBoy line. I didn't use it that much, though... mainly because using a start-up disc was kind of a pain in the ass and (let's face it) portable games look pretty crappy when displayed on a full screen.
Just noticed there's no Famicom Disk system on here either. That was a big flop.
N64DD got my vote
Some of those things aren't even add-ons.Quote:
Originally Posted by mrbigreddog
I voted but I forgot to post my vote.
Nintendo 64DD. It had 9 (yes, nine!) games released for it and was discontinued shortly after it was released.
Definitely the Jaguar CD...no one even bought a Jaguar, much less an add on system for it.
There were almost no games for Jaguar, so why how many games could there be for Jaguar CD?
The SGX could have been an addon device. It's possible with the PCE's external bus. And there was a CD unit made for it (without a need for a funky adapter), but no bi-compatible or direct CD games made for it, sadly. Never understood why the didn't include the extra VDC, priority chip, and extra 24k of ram into the Duo. But either way, you can still make SGX CD games (even SGX ACD games). I've made a few SGX CD demos without any trouble. Twice the vram (128k), twice the BG layers, twice the sprite pixel bandwidth (32/512pixels VS SNES 32/272 and Genesis 20/320) and 2megabytes of ram for the ACD cart... is a pretty powerful setup. Not to mention the SGX fixes a bug in the PCE audio. It allows you to stream up to 112khz sample playback with very low CPU overhead (it has a short 32sample buffer that you refill with the PCE's cpu timer).Quote:
Since Supergrafx isn't really an add-on that wouldn't be included though. (in fact, had it been an add-on -facilitated by the awsome expansion bus- it may have been a good deal more successful, especially if integerated with a CD unit like Sega did -with a much more limited expansion bus at that)
it would have been intersting if the sgx's dual GPUs could combine pixels as well as overlaying (again, as chilly willy's suggestion for the Genesis), with external RAMDAC and expanded palette, etc. An expanded master palette alone would have been pretty great with the numerous subpalettes, but a combined pixel mode (8-bit color) would have been great for FMV if nothing else. (though good in general for a number of things, basicly any situation where you wouldn't need the double BG and sprites it might be preferred, espeically for prerendered/digitized graphics -or if they did any 3D stuff, but you'd need a coprocessor for any decent 3D -other than cheating with streaming video and sprites like Silpheed, something like Novastorm would look way better than on the Sega CD as well along with pretty much any streaming video not created with the palette limits in mind -ie BC Racer)
But that would assume the PCE's GPU has a pixel bus comperable to the MD VDP, and I have no idea about that.
Tomaitheous,
By "could have been done though the expansion port" do you mean a sgx compatible add-on for the PCE could have been made, or just that a similar device could have been created to work on the expansion bus?
If they had made an expansion using the connector, maybe they could have offered a version built into a CD base unit/interface, thus owners of the CD unit would only need to purchase the new interface, and not pay for another CD drive. (which I'd assume was th emost expensive part) Granted that wouldn't work with the directly linking turbo CD. (you'd need to add soem kind of bridge in between in that case)
In fact, it may have been cheaper to only release the enhanced base unit (for use with or without CD) so as to limit to a single product and avoid conflict for users later wanting to upgrade to CD. (as they's otherwise need to purchase the enhanced base unit rather than just the CD)
Meh, all hypothetical, but interesting to think about. ;)
The Jaguar may not have been a success in general, but early on it did keep atari afloat with no other sourse of revinue (it was profitable, at least through 1994), that's whay they did that crappy test market thing (really shoudl have included europe though). The Jag was a mess overall though, managed poorly, and even given the circumstances it should have been possible to do better. (if nothing else, dip into private funds to keep things together long enough for a propper rollout, a bit of a risc, but probably reasonble -of course they wouldn't have the hindsight of knowing they'd win that Sega Lawsuit and get the resulting funds in 1994)Quote:
Originally Posted by PimpUigi
As I already addressed in post# 5, the Jaguar CD was cut short by Sam Tramiel's heart attack, then the company being sold off to JTS (leaving the Tramiels pretty well off), but given the state the Jag was in at the time, it was going to be rough with Sony pusing ahead and Nintendo entering the 5th gen market.
Besides that, the games ont he Jaguar CD were above average, and many are top teir titles for the jag, plus some petty good ports of classic FMV games like Dragon's Lair, plus Myst. Iron Soldier II and Battlemorph exceed their predicessors in pretty much every aspect, both look much better, sound better -with CD soundtracks, and fine tuned the gameplay -especially Battlemorph compared to Cybermorph, similar with the hoverstrike sequel. (better framerate, textures, and sound) Highlander is kind of debatable (simple 3D models over prerendered BG, kind of like Alone in the Dark or Resident Evil, based on the Highlander Cartoon -and featuring clips of said cartoon). I think baldies was decent.
And world tour racing was way better than checkered flag. (controll, framerate, grapics -featuring textures, and sound)
Too bad there wasn't a CD Doom release, all the Jag version really needed was music, and a CD port with the 3DO tracks would have been awesome! (they probably could have included added enemies and missing levels with the added space too, but then again, the 3DO and first PSX ports used the standard Jaguar Level set, so that would probably be unlikely)
N64DD by the whole field. Only 15,000 sold (in Japan only) and only 9 games... makes the 32X and Jaguar CD seem like stunning successes! :D
I personally wonder why on earth the 64DD was released in Japan only when the N64 did pretty well here compared to Japan. That would be like releasing the SCD only in Japan.
This poll be trippin', but I voted for the N64DD anyway.
It's all personal opinion anyways... This is my personal opinion on a list of what I consider addons, and you can vote or not vote, comment or not comment.... I like to hear all of it all the same anyways! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Rusty Venture
By a sales standpoint which counts as a flop. The N64DD takes the cake. I mean the unit sold 5000 less than the Jag CD... that is really bad.
I would pick the Playstation if you consider that it was originally meant as a SNES addon, then it was instead used against Nintendo and made Sony take over as industry leader. For all of the blunders Sega did in the 90's, Nintendo made the single biggest one.
Its not on the poll but I'd vote for the GBA e reader. I still have some unopened card packs for that thing.
Funfact: I have been using the 360s HD-DVD drive as my primary dvd player for a couple of years, it was just replaced by my recent purchase of a PS3.
Well, I'd say less than 9 actually, 4 disks were different parts to the pack-in mario artist, and 2 games were expansions to existing others (one of which for another disk game). So counting mario artist as 1, and excluding the 2 expansions (which were not standalone games), you're down to only 4 complete games released! (which is fewer than supergrafx)Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilly Willy
And compared tot he Jag CD (with 20,000 units shipped), not only did it sell worse, but far moreso given the amout of base units out there, in Japan alone. (with only ~225,000 Jaguars produced)
Why? Doesn't the 360 work fine as a DVD player with no modifiations/add-ons. (opposed to the Xbox which required a remote iirc)Quote:
Originally Posted by GohanX
Yeah, but sony ended up abandong that hardware, and who's to say that they wouldn't have entered the market without the failed nintendo partnership.Quote:
Originally Posted by GeckoYamori
Worse would have been if Nintendo hadn't gotten out when they did. From what I understand, that agreement put Nintendo in a horrible position for CD releases (with sony haing almost sole control over content released on the platform -possibly excpting Nintendo published stuff). Which is why the posible Sony-Sega partnership over the PSX seems kind of dubious to me. Especially given that, in all the articles referring to it, none mention anything on 3rd pary licencing -only that hardware costs were to be split and each had rights to 1st party software, so Sega very well may have gotten screwed by that deal.
Getting the HD DVD player let you connect your 360 via VGA, which I don't believe was possible without it.
A good alternative for those wanting 1080p, since the 360 didn't have HDMI in those times.
I'd call that a *JOKE* more than a flop.Quote:
Originally Posted by GohanX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Baloo
Proof by webpage or it didn't happen.
I think he meant those Asian PSX consoles that were modified to play VideoCDs. Actually, I think those were pretty popular in Asia.Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigmus
That's weird, I'd have thought the 360's A/V output VGA. Doesn't Component video support 1080p too?Quote:
Originally Posted by PimpUigi
Component doesn't seem to let you output HDCP content I think is what it is.
My older Bro's "Falcon" 360 doesn't output 1080p through Component. Just a black screen, then reverts back to the previous setting. It can output 1080i though. Hope that helps. =/
It doesn't matter mcuh as iirc most games just get upscaled from 720p when set to 1080p. (not sure if 480i/p are downscaled or have specific rendering modes -I'd assume the latter due to text if nothing else -and it may render in 480p only then interlace it -hopefully limiting to 30 fps to avoid combing)
But since the original comment on the 360 HDDVD player was in the context of playing standard DVDs, I don't see how HDCP would matter. (or displaying 1080p for that matter, or anything other than 480 since that what dvds use -actual they're in 480i so they need conversion, which is what specific DVD players do -removign combing as well -which shouldn't have been there in the first place -stupid 2-3 pulldown, fine for VCDs as those were in 240p, but 480/60i should be trated as 30 fps, so it should have been something like 2-2-2-4 pulldown instead -different for 50 Hz of course -more like 2x23-4 pull down)
http://www.trhonline.com/obscure/psxvcd/top1.jpgQuote:
Originally Posted by Chilly Willy
How much did this sell for? I'd hardly count this (unofficial surely?) addon a failure.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kool kitty89
Quote:
Originally Posted by PimpUigi
Component doesn't support HDCP at all, because it's an analog connection and HDCP only works for digital connections such as DVI and HDMI. Because of this HDCP/analog issue, both Blu-ray and HD DVD specifications include a so-called Image Constraint Token (ICT) that can be enabled on a disc. When set, the player will automatically downscale the 1080p video to a resolution of 960x540 if it is transmitted over an analog connection. However, no disc so far has ICT enabled, which means that all HD movies can be viewed over Component in their full resolution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guntz
The problem with 1080p over Component is that the specification for Component connections does not officially include 1080p support. It is technically possible though and the Xbox 360 unofficially supports 1080p over Component. However, only a small fraction of TV's (most notably Samsung LCD's) can actually process this signal. In other words, it's convenient if your equipment can do 1080p over Component, but for full compatibility, you'll want to use HDMI.
Another thing with Component is that the DVD-Video specification does not allow video content to be transmitted over an analog connection in upscaled HD resolutions. That is why the Xbox 360 will only display DVD's in resolutions up to 480p or 576p over a Component connection. This has nothing to do with technical limitations, it's just "not allowed by the spec".
What about standalone DVD players with advertised upscaling functionality?Quote:
Originally Posted by Devil N
So long as they send their upscaled signal over HDMI, it's not a problem. You won't get upscaling over Component though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pulstar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chilly Willy
Odd that it's unofficial given the MPEG expansions for 3DO and Saturn (plus CD32 and CD-i of course), with 3DO in particular, the VCD capability I beleive is one of its saving graces for Asian sales. (probably contributing to Saturn as well -apparently popular enough to merit some games using it)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pulstar
On another note: I'm not sure why the DC didn't have built-in VCD functionality. (CPU should be fast enough to handel it -maybe even SVCDs) Seems kind of odd, not really important in the west, but quite significant in Asia.
Did that PSX add-on require the parallel port?
Some do, but the only use is if the DVD players video scaling hardware is better than the TVs. (so long as it can output 480p, it should be fine -deinterlacing being another issue)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pulstar
This is getting a little off topic, but how does the Xbox 360 know if it's outputting to a SD or HD/EDTV? My freind's only has a 480p option, no 480i like the Wii/Xbox etc, yet it works perfectly fine via component video on his CRT SDTV. So does it only output 480i via component or what?
I wonder the same abotu progressive DVD, Blu Ray players and such, do all of those have a 480i vs 480p (or native 720p/1080i/1080p for blu ray) option?
I Second the E-reader... as the biggest flop.. I mean think about it you had to buy pack of Cards just to play the NES version of Tennis (Etc.) on you GBA...
The only redemming factors for the system IMO was the bonus levels in Super Mario 3 and the Animal crossing connectivity..