mega man 8: saturn vs playstation

[retrospiel]

Well, all we got is rumors.


And from what I know things were worse on Saturn. MUCH worse.

[OldSchool]

I can't wait to get my copies of Megaman X7 and X8 in the mail... oh goodie gum drops!

(PS2)

[Aarzak]

I bought a loose copy of X7 from GS ($5) over a month ago, and returned it a week later.

As a long-time MM/MMX fan, I can safely say that X7 is one of the worst MM games I've ever played. The controls are sloppy, as is the camera. HORRIBLE camera. I wanted to like it, really, but lost patience with it. It's a real bitch trying to collect hostages (ala X6) too, as some die OFF-SCREEN due to enemy projectiles/attacks before you even get to them. Zero, who was a beast in previous games, was nerfed in X7 as his saber swings have shitty range and speed. He's useless until he starts getting boss weapons. Oh, and you can't play as X until you collect 64 hostages.

Nice production values though, especially after Capcom slacked off with X5 & X6.

Haven't played X8, but I've heard that they've at least done away with the ill-received 3D segments of X7. X6 left me with a bad taste in my mouth many years ago, and I've rarely revisited the MM series after playing it. Perhaps I just got burned out too......

[j_factor]

It sold extremely well on multiple system's before the 32-bit versions even came out,

That's not true in North America. The Amiga was dead, Jaguar sales were a wasteland, the 16-bit versions didn't come out, and the CD32 didn't really exist here (some were sold, but barely). Only the PC version, and later Playstation, sold in any large quantity.

This means nothing, at the end of the day each territory decides which games are released, Sony published the 16-bit versions of Mickey Mania and when it came to the PS1 version each territory decides whether they specifically want the game, Sony Europe did, Sony America did not, Sony America had nothing to do with Mickey Mania at all.

Yes, and that's not remotely the same thing as refusing a third party game. And it's a port of a 1-2 year old Genesis game that wasn't even that big of a hit in the first place, so tell me why SCEA should've been so enthused to bring it out?

You're making supposition, I'm talking about information and interviews I've actually read in magazines from the time.

Let's see some citations then.

You just sound like you're making up excuses now, there were tons and tons of really awful 3D games on PS1, where was the fair and unbiased Sony quality control that you've been talking about?!!? Rapid Reload doesn't make the cut because its "relatively short" but games which have pretty much no redeeming features like Rascal do?!

How many "really awful" 3D games were released by Sony? Rascal was published by Psygnosis, which was owned by Sony, but during that time was given autonomy to make their own publishing decisions. Incidentally, Rascal had good graphics for the time, and the characters were designed by Jim Henson's Creature Shop; those are redeeming features from a publisher's standpoint, even if the game was crap.

Rapid Reload looks and plays like a 16-bit game and has no extra features or play modes. SCEA's decision not to bring it out here is neither surprising nor unwarranted. It's a fun game, but neither the press nor the 32-bit-console-owning public was receptive to that sort of game at the time. When Astal, which at least has much better graphics than Rapid Reload, came out for Saturn, Next Gen's review said it answered the question of if it was worthwhile to release 2d side-scrolling action games on 32-bit systems, and the answer was "no". Other reviews had the same attitude, and the game was not a hit.

Neither Beyond the Beyond, nor Samurai Shodown 3 managed to get released in Europe though so those games hardly got through easy.

What Sony Europe didn't release is hardly relevant.

[Thenewguy]

That's not true in North America. The Amiga was dead, Jaguar sales were a wasteland, the 16-bit versions didn't come out, and the CD32 didn't really exist here (some were sold, but barely). Only the PC version, and later Playstation, sold in any large quantity.

irrelevant, I said Worms sold very well and it did, nobody cares if it wasn't popular in your particular part of the world.

Yes, and that's not remotely the same thing as refusing a third party game.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by this section, we were debating whether or not the Sony territories had a policy against 2D games, what does the game being 3rd party or 1st party have to do with anything at all? Travellers Tales developed the game, it was alllowed release in Europe and published by SCEE, when it came to being released in the US it was denied release by the US people who pretty much had no prior involvement with the game at all.

Let's see some citations then.

Meh, I've wasted enough time with you already, here's the worms interview



If I have nothing to do later maybe I'll search through my older magazines (the interview I posted was from a Retro-gamer from a year or two ago so it wasn't particularly hard to find) to find where I read the information and scan it.

How many "really awful" 3D games were released by Sony?

Seriously?!

You're actually arguing that there weren't many bad 3D games....on the PS1?

Blasto, and the Crazy Frog game spring to mind, there were tons more but I don't have a mind for noticing and remembering masses of bad games.

When Astal, which at least has much better graphics than Rapid Reload, came out for Saturn, Next Gen's review said it answered the question of if it was worthwhile to release 2d side-scrolling action games on 32-bit systems, and the answer was "no". Other reviews had the same attitude, and the game was not a hit.

Yeah but Astal was a crap game so its not a particularly fair comparison, Rapid Reload is far better than Astal.

I also completely disagree about the graphics in Rapid Reload, the graphics pretty much contain the best of both the SNES and Mega Drive hardware's, with colourful graphics, transparency effects, graphical effects and fast action packed game play, neither 16-bits could have done the game on their own without downgrading the graphics or gameplay.

What Sony Europe didn't release is hardly relevant.

why? because only America matters? the two territories both had tendencies to hold up 2D releases, looking at both areas helps to show what kind of guidelines they were both following. Beyond the Beyond and SS3 managed to scrape past in the US but in Europe they did not, in Europe Mickeymania and Earthworm Jim 2 managed to scrape past but in the US they did not.

[j_factor]

irrelevant, I said Worms sold very well and it did, nobody cares if it wasn't popular in your particular part of the world.

I was talking about my part of the world the entire time. You said nothing of it when I specifically said "in North America" in my earlier post; now all of a sudden you're changing the subject.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean by this section, we were debating whether or not the Sony territories had a policy against 2D games, what does the game being 3rd party or 1st party have to do with anything at all?

You're joking right? We were originally talking about Mega Man 8 and X4 and whether Sony was giving third parties a hard time with their 2d games. Sony's relations with third parties and their approval process for a license is a separate issue from Sony's decision-making on where they do and don't release their own games. They don't work the same way and the standards are not the same. You are conflating the two for no good reason.

Travellers Tales developed the game, it was alllowed release in Europe and published by SCEE, when it came to being released in the US it was denied release by the US people who pretty much had no prior involvement with the game at all.

It was not denied release. "Denying" release is when some company wants to release it and Sony says no. Failing to release their own game isn't the same as denying.

Seriously?!

You're actually arguing that there weren't many bad 3D games....on the PS1?

Blasto, and the Crazy Frog game spring to mind, there were tons more but I don't have a mind for noticing and remembering masses of bad games.

No... for fuck's sake, that is not what I said. But, yes, Blasto is one of the few poor Sony games. I didn't say they were perfect; even the best game companies have a dud here and there.

Yeah but Astal was a crap game so its not a particularly fair comparison, Rapid Reload is far better than Astal.

Publishers don't necessarily look at how "good" a game is when deciding to bring it out, they look at how marketable it is.

I also completely disagree about the graphics in Rapid Reload, the graphics pretty much contain the best of both the SNES and Mega Drive hardware's, with colourful graphics, transparency effects, graphical effects and fast action packed game play, neither 16-bits could have done the game on their own without downgrading the graphics or gameplay.

Neither Genesis nor SNES could have done the game exactly as it is, but it certainly looks and plays like a 16-bit game. I'm watching a video right now to refresh my memory. It's simply not an impressive "next gen" game for the time. It looks like a Genesis game with a better color palette and a transparency or zoom effect here and there. Big deal.

why? because only America matters?

No, because America was the subject of discussion. I was never talking about Europe. I don't know Sony Europe and I'm not going to argue about what they did or didn't do. If you want to argue about Sony Europe, leave me out of it; don't reply to my posts that clearly talk about America with arguments that pertain to Europe.

the two territories both had tendencies to hold up 2D releases, looking at both areas helps to show what kind of guidelines they were both following. Beyond the Beyond and SS3 managed to scrape past in the US but in Europe they did not, in Europe Mickeymania and Earthworm Jim 2 managed to scrape past but in the US they did not.

That is a very simplistic and inaccurate assessment. SCEA went out of their way to release SS3; it didn't "scrape past" in any sense whatsoever.

You're cherry picking games to read a pattern that isn't there. There's nothing unusual about a game not being released in every territory. It happened a lot and there are myriad reasons for it. Whizz didn't get released for US Saturn, but that doesn't mean it was denied release by Sega of America because they had a policy against isometric games. Neither did Atlantis, but that doesn't mean it was denied due to a policy against point and click adventure games. There are also plenty of 3D Playstation games that didn't get a release worldwide. It happens.

[OldSchool]

PS2 versions:

Both MX 7 and 8 ROCK!! Graphically, they're gorgeous, they handle really well, and the sound is solid enough (music's a lil meh, but I'll live). I don't understand why I can't duck on version 8 though... kinda sucks.


They're both very impressive additions to my Megaman Collection.

[zetastrike]

PS2 versions:

Both MX 7 and 8 ROCK!! Graphically, they're gorgeous, they handle really well, and the sound is solid enough (music's a lil meh, but I'll live). I don't understand why I can't duck on version 8 though... kinda sucks.


They're both very impressive additions to my Megaman Collection.

MMHP said the level design was garbage in X8

[ApolloBoy]

PS2 versions:

Both MX 7 and 8 ROCK!! Graphically, they're gorgeous, they handle really well, and the sound is solid enough (music's a lil meh, but I'll live). I don't understand why I can't duck on version 8 though... kinda sucks.


They're both very impressive additions to my Megaman Collection.

I thought X7 was pretty bad, and that's coming from a big MM fan. X8, on the other hand, was quite good and a nice return to form.

[Da_Shocker]

Neither Genesis nor SNES could have done the game exactly as it is, but it certainly looks and plays like a 16-bit game. I'm watching a video right now to refresh my memory. It's simply not an impressive "next gen" game for the time. It looks like a Genesis game with a better color palette and a transparency or zoom effect here and there. Big deal.

I agree this game looks good but not great it seems to be a bit on the slow side and there is no 2 player mode. It doesn't blow Gunstar Hero's away liek it should.

[OldSchool]

I thought X7 was pretty bad, and that's coming from a big MM fan. X8, on the other hand, was quite good and a nice return to form.

Why can't I duck on version 8? Works fine on 7...

[sme198]

@ J_factor

Do you remember when you first heard that Capcom was developing mega man 8 for saturn first? Do you remember where you heard it from?

[ApolloBoy]

Why can't I duck on version 8? Works fine on 7...

My beef with X7 is the switch to a 3D third-person perspective, instead of using a 2.5D approach like X8. The duck was a nice feature, but it's one I can live without. Mega Man games don't generally translate well to a 3D perspective, with the exceptions of the MM Legends games.

[OldSchool]

My beef with X7 is the switch to a 3D third-person perspective, instead of using a 2.5D approach like X8. The duck was a nice feature, but it's one I can live without. Mega Man games don't generally translate well to a 3D perspective, with the exceptions of the MM Legends games.

Hmm, they translated beautifully imo in both X7 & X8.

[j_factor]

@ J_factor

Do you remember when you first heard that Capcom was developing mega man 8 for saturn first? Do you remember where you heard it from?

Maybe I'm wrong and it was X4, not 8:

Hot on the heels of Mega Man 8 comes Mega Man X, the latest in Capcom's futuristic spin-off series. This fourth game is being programmed specifically to utilize the advantages Sega's Saturn offers; consequently, no PlayStation version is planned - yet.

I remember it being the case with 8. But it was a long time ago, so I might be misremembering. Either that, or they were both originally supposed to be Saturn exclusives before going multiplatform.