Your personal hate in the gaming world.

[Zoltor]

It's mainstream now. As it is in Japan. Developers don't care about what's easy and dumbed down, they care about what turns a profit. For the ones who do keep up appearances and kiss consumer's ass by asking what they want, I haven't heard a collective moan put to them about the difficulty of games. In fact, I've seen many of these 'Remakes' as fan service, unasked for.



People who equate 'Dumb & Lazy' to video games, won't be swayed in their opinion by pushing the whole medium over the deep end into a fringe hobby for the anal retentive. You seem to believe it would somehow make it 'The Good old days' again. You also fail to realize that video games aren't exactly what's USA is known for either, so your fears about any misconceptions arising due to them being 'watered down' is a bit extreme.

You're being obtuse and ignorant, behind your justifications.

You need to put gaming in a perspective. It's a toy hobby for enjoyment, that's all it ever was. Like other mediums, there are periods that pass by and never come back.
You don't like new games? Quit playing them. Grow up, move on with your life, or better yet acknowledge and accept them for what they are while occasionally getting a decent oldschool title from the developers who try to mix it up and stay provocative in a modern market.

Just don't start shitting on modern games, and calling gamers 'Lazy' because they don't accept your absurd tastes. It cheapens your own expressions by coating them with ignorance.

One of these days, you are gonna need to learn to read between the lines. Clearly developers have in a way listened to these crybabies, because they got it in their heads, that amaricans don't like difficult games. While developers are probally not asking directly what a certian group likes, I'm sure they are reading about their games on forums, plus reading gamer reviews like the ones found on gamefaq, and seeing what complaints people may have.

There is basically 2 bogus complaints that tend to pop up often, It's too difficult or It's too long(lol too long, I find that pretty funny, but yes, a bunch of people seem to complain about a game, because it can't be finnished in like 40 houres or under).


I'll make this fast, and simple, looking at a walkthrough, because you can't figure it out(out as fast as you would like to, I should say), is taking the easy way out, which inturn is lazyness.

[JRedmond3]

I think it has more to do with games becoming more mainstream and for casual gamers. I don't think game companies have ever really listened to the fans so I'm not sure they would start now.

More people playing games = More dumb gamers = Easier Games

[Zoltor]

I think it has more to do with games becoming more mainstream and for casual gamers. I don't think game companies have ever really listened to the fans so I'm not sure they would start now.

More people playing games = More dumb gamers = Easier Games

Well I could buy that, if difficult games in general weren't made anymore, but that's not the case, they just aren't brought over here(ATLUS, and somewhat NIS being the exceptions of course).

Even developers/publishers that publish tons of games over here a year(including the difficult games in Japan), won't bring such games over.

[Knuckle Duster]

I think it has more to do with games becoming more mainstream and for casual gamers. I don't think game companies have ever really listened to the fans so I'm not sure they would start now.

More people playing games = More dumb gamers = Easier Games

Yes, it's mainstream and logically:
Harder or Old style games = Less people playing games = Less profit incentive.

Zoltor's pissing into the wind here, complaining that walkthroughs somehow 'ruin' gaming, when it's actually something which rose out of necessity due to hard games in the first place.

Complaining as if there were some noble breed of gamer dying off because of it's accessibility.

The likely reality & how I see it: He's just a guy complaining about his own assumptions, unable to find value in modern games, who's compelled generalize and argue. Elitist & full of entitlement, missing the point.

[kokujin]

Sorry, but I really don't think it would be possible for me to care less about it. Games have been going down hill ever since 3D hit.

Very true.

Yes, it's mainstream and logically:
Harder or Old style games = Less people playing games = Less profit incentive.

Zoltor's pissing into the wind here, complaining that walkthroughs somehow 'ruin' gaming, when it's actually something which rose out of necessity due to hard games in the first place.

Complaining as if there were some noble breed of gamer dying off because of it's accessibility.

The likely reality & how I see it: He's just a guy complaining about his own assumptions, unable to find value in modern games, who's compelled generalize and argue. Elitist & full of entitlement, missing the point.

I've been here for a little while, and after reading some of your posts, I get the feeling you like the state video games are in right now.Would this assumption be correct?

[Zoltor]

Sorry, but I really don't think it would be possible for me to care less about it. Games have been going down hill ever since 3D hit.

Omg so true, but I don't think we should be ok with games continuing down this path.

[kokujin]

Omg so true, but I don't think we should be ok with games continuing down this path.

The big thing people just can't understand is that certain genre's are better in 2D.

[Zoltor]

The big thing people just can't understand is that certain genre's are better in 2D.

Exactly, and it drives me nuts, that developers, along with a lot of new school gamers as well, can't seem to grasp such a simple fact.

[kool kitty89]

Walkthroughs and cheats aren't hit or miss, they are what they are & you either use them or you don't. The point of gaming is to have fun, if cheating keeps a particular disc spinning longer and not sitting on a shelf, that's cool. If a walkthrough helps you get something you otherwise would have missed out on. Big deal.

How is this detrimental to gaming? You seriously complain about the most bizarre things, and most of the time with an edge of entitlement.

Exactly, that's why cheats, hacks, walkthroughs, etc are good fun.

Be it a game I've already played though and just want to play around with with cheats on, or using cheats to go back in and get/do/see things I was never going to see/do otherwise, it's always fun to do.

As for downloading saves, it's the same thing, all good fun: be it stuff you were never going to get/unlock (especially unlock) or a game you already beat but lost the save to and don't want to go though the time/effort to go all the way through it again, it's all good. It's the same as having a database/strategy guide with all the save passwords in it.
And for that matter, strategy guides have been around for a VERY long time, as are general tutorials and video walkthroughs going back to the early 80s (ever heard of "how to beat home video games" ? -check youtube).
Nintendo power did that too, with hints/pointers/maps/semi-walkthroughs in the magazine itself, let alone the Nintendo Power guides. (then there was the Nintendo help hotline)

The only difference with the internet is that it's free rather than having to buy/subscribe to something.

It's certainly nothing new, just more accessible and freely available.

I mean you can argue people are lazy doing some of that stuff, but if they're lazy enough to do that, they'd likely not even bother with a lot of games they're playing. If you're too impatient to enjoy a game on your own, that's one thing, but if such things help you to enjoy something you otherwise never would, that's another thing entirely.

It's like if you have a game you really like, but suck at and you get to watch a friend/sibling/parent/etc play through it years before you were good enough to, etc. For some it may take away the incentive, but for me, it generally only makes me want to play more.




It's not just cheating/hacking devices either, but games that explicitly include cheat codes in them: sometimes a bit subtle in use (ie pausing and inputting a certain combination, etc), but in other cases they put it right in your face with a code input menu, or as part of the difficulty options. (lucas arts did that for the rogue squadron series and some others, while the X-Wing series bypassed that and just put invincibility/unlimited ammo/collision options in the options menu -even then it doesn't really make it easy for some levels, namely escort missions)

Hate is a strong word. I hate Senator Joe Lieberman and his anti video game bullshit.

Don't forget Jack Thompson.

Sorry, but I really don't think it would be possible for me to care less about it. Games have been going down hill ever since 3D hit.

That depends on the genres you like, I like a lot of 3D genres and some peaked well after that in general, and several non-3D genres as well (some of the greatest graphic adventure games came well after 3D was established in the mainstream), but they still declined to the point of barely being present in the mainstream today. (albeit you get a fair amount of graphic adventure/puzzle games on the DS, but not really the same sort of games you had in the 90s with graphic adventures, and you certianly don't see space combat sims like you did in the 90s)

My favorite genres (namely graphic adventure and space sims) declined steeply after 2000, and 3D definitely wasn't the problem there, just shift in genres in general. (especially the rise of FPS, though I like FPSs, they're not my favorite)
I like 3D platformers a lot too, but there hasn't been one this generation that really did it for me. (I like SM64, Sonic Adventure 1/2, and some of the other 3rd party platformers, but nothing really big this generation, there was a lot last generation, some of which I haven't gotten to -and any PS2 exclusives- but not this generation, and I really don't care for SM Galaxy)

I like 2D platformers too (less so beat em' ups and some other sidescrollers), but I generally suck at them other than some of the easier games, especially those with saving. Not necessarily easier either, but just certain types of platformers. I like most of the Sonic Games (the save feature of Sonic 3/3&K especially) and Yoshi's Island is great (again the saving is good too), but I've never cared for some others, or I liked them (or really wanted to), but found them way too difficult for my skillset.

Racing games were definitely something I prefer in 3D, adn 3D action/adventure games are great (Zelda among others, though I like most of the 2D zelda games too, but a ton of that this generation and some that cross more into the RPG category), and RPGs I don't really like more in 3D than 2D, it really depends on the game though. (I tend to like RPGs, but they also get a bit consuming once you're really into it... though I tend to get like that for a lot of games -either it's totally casual, or I go all hard core and play WAY too long at a time -I used to do that with X-Wing among others)

3D flight combat sims (realistic and fantasy) are still fairly strong at least, and that's definitely somethign I'll be goign into once I get into current gen games. (ie get a decent gaming PC or PS3/360, more likely the former)
There's also a number of good survival horror tiles and FPSs that I haven't touched at all (I haven't done much more than browsed or played with some friends).


But really, I don't really mind where things are goign in terms of genre, though I don't necessarily like the shift to DL only stuff, especially the way some of that is handled and the cumbersome DRM issues of more recent games. (making used games tougher to use is definitely a turn off to gaming in general)
But if I wasn't into retro gaming, I think I'd complain a lot more: as it is, I've got dozens of old games to go through that I missed from years past on various platforms (especially PC games), so I'm pretty set other than actually getting together a machine that can run some of those well. (others are fine on modern computers/OSs or with emulation)



I also don't like some of the shift to online multiplayer so much either: both in terms of shifting away from single player gameplay and away from LAN or splitscreen local multiplayer in general. That particularly includes cooperative gameplay of the main campaign -which would be integral to good single-player gameplay as well. (with the exception of a few games with the main campaign a lot more fun to play co-op due to crappy friendly AI players without another human playing or some other issues in that line) In the case of co-op, there are cases of good online too, but the issue of a good single player/cooperative story/campaign/etc is still critical there.

This isn't new either, but it's just finally actually becoming a mainstream trend and the rule rather than the exception. (back in 1997 you had X-Wing vs Tie Fighter wich initially focused almost entirely on multiplayer and was criticized so heavily that a comprehensive expansion was added with proper single player campaigns later integrated into the standard game package)

[gamevet]

up, down, up, down, left, right, left, right, b, a, start!

[kool kitty89]

It's less harmful than Alcohol, and is subject to prohibition laws that have undermined a huge number of manufacturing sector jobs for Americans and put a massive strain on the environment due to using less renewable sources. (Textiles, medicine, paper, fabrics, food.) I'm not a pot smoker or a tree hugger either, just a rational Canadian who knows bullshit when I see it.

It's less harmful than alcohol in excess, but more harmful than alcohol in moderation, just as cigar or cigarette smoking is more harmful than alcohol in moderation.
You aren't going to parminently harm your body (or harm it at all in most cases) from consuming alcohol in moderation (ie in amounts that your body can fully metabolize at non-toxic levels), but smoking to any extent is harmful in a number of areas.
Of course, you don't have to smoke it. (baking+ingesting it eliminates that issue)

Also hemp is legally used in the US too, just not the varieties with significant amount of certain chemicals present (namely THC), it's not very common though. (you occasionally see hemp twine around) It's rather limited in use for certain things, and not always more efficient than alternatives in the roles it is used. (honestly there's MUCH better aread that we could be focusing on in terms of alternative resources)

[Knuckle Duster]

I've been here for a little while, and after reading some of your posts, I get the feeling you like the state video games are in right now.Would this assumption be correct?

To me, the state of video games as they are right now is that they're doing great.

They're generally cheaper to acquire, there's more genres than before, and there's usually something for everybody. It's easier to make them, distribute them, and get feedback directly from customers.

Do I play them as much as I used to in my free time? Not so much, the genres I like have become stale, cliche and are in decline.

The way I see it is that there's no use whining about games that aren't being made for, or targeted at me. It's like music, just because I listen to obscure metal, doesn't mean I go out of my way to piss and moan about pop shit like Justin Bieber or Nickleback. I could do it, but it would change nothing and make me look like an idiot for having wasted my time on it.

It's not like I 'want' everybody to think of my favorite game type as popular and heavily focused upon. Why should I care that much? Developers obviously still cater to 'everybody', even today.

Aside from that, one needs to recognize that like music, movies, or comic books. Gaming has different periods that are defined by specific content. (Games made for 13 year olds aren't exactly worth my ridicule these days.)

Recognizing an obvious decline of a particular genre does not need to incite panic from it's fan base. Zoltor is an exceptional minority in this case. He would rather ride the roller-coaster downward while kicking and screaming about 'Walkthroughs', completely oblivious to why they exist in the first place; Blaming them for the decline and his feeling of neglect.

As to the state of the content distribution, I prefer not to go digital download, but I recognize that I can get fair use out of it.
I'm not foolish enough to 'collect' new games so they can sit on a shelf for 300 years and expect them to still work. There's no ridiculous compulsion within me to hold them at some high value. I still think the after-market is great and in danger because of it, which is why I choose physical copies when I can. I'm not one to get outraged & completely stop just because I can't hold games anymore, I'd continue to gauge the cost & experience, while making practical backups of all the content I purchase.

It's less harmful than alcohol in excess, but more harmful than alcohol in moderation, just as cigar or cigarette smoking is more harmful than alcohol in moderation.
You aren't going to parminently harm your body (or harm it at all in most cases) from consuming alcohol in moderation (ie in amounts that your body can fully metabolize at non-toxic levels), but smoking to any extent is harmful in a number of areas.
Of course, you don't have to smoke it. (baking+ingesting it eliminates that issue)

Also hemp is legally used in the US too, just not the varieties with significant amount of certain chemicals present (namely THC), it's not very common though. (you occasionally see hemp twine around) It's rather limited in use for certain things, and not always more efficient than alternatives in the roles it is used. (honestly there's MUCH better aread that we could be focusing on in terms of alternative resources)

Alcohol use in moderation is significant at raising your risks of getting various types of cancer. It's just something that isn't focused upon regarding education. It's a huge elephant in the room that nobody wants to talk about.

I haven't seen much moderate usage studies put forward about the effects of marijuana itself to compare it to. It's usually done by groups polarized between radically social conservative opinions, and those who believe it actually cures cancer when refined to hemp oil. It's two different types of 'crazy' as far as I'm concerned.

With the alternative resources, hemp could easily be grown anywhere and is highly renewable. With modern technology, it could be cultivated and refined efficiently to meet current product standards. A tree's a tree though. There's limits to what it can do for you.

[runback22]

In what way, because It's not all bad.

I meant the forums. Go in there and proceed to the Halo Reach board. Make a topic about that game that does anything but praise it as the 2nd coming and watch the fireworks begin.

[old man]

People worried about brain cells should probably quit 'gaming' all together. Excessive playing of video games is known to shorten the attention span and impair learning ability.

[Defolto]

People worried about brain cells should probably quit 'gaming' all together. Excessive playing of video games is known to shorten the attention span and impair learning ability.

Key word "excessive" just take a break every hour for 10-20 min. Too much of anything is bad for you.