This is why I love this board

[Genesis Knight]

See, that's what I'm talking about. Retro gamers will play hundreds of marginally different platformers, shmups, and fighting games and argue over the minuscule differences and variations between them for hours, but when it comes to first person shooters suddenly every game is identical all the way back to Goldeneye 64.

[Cornholio857]

Not necessarily. That's the last FPS that I played to death. (ie: That really caught my attention) I have however put in a few hours with MW2, the Halo sequels and others. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed Halo 2 and 3, but they didn't hold my attention as much as the first. And believe it or not, I'm actually looking forward to Battlefield 3 and Halo Anniversary.

[sketch]

The last FPS that I played to death was Halo: Combat Evolved. The Single Player campaign and the story had me hooked for hours. The sequels, not so much.

I did play Halo through to the end and enjoyed it. Borderlands is another that I finished. Once I had beaten the games, though, that was it. Goldeneye had a lot of replay value for me. I played through numerous times, and spent a lot of time in deathmatches.

The Halo sequels felt like more of the same and I quickly lost interest as well.

[sheath]

The thing about platformers and shooters is they don't have the same control schemes. Sometimes they don't even have the same jump button. First person shooters literally all have the same controls. I haven't seen an FPS deviate from these controls since the original Xbox and PS2.

[Genesis Knight]

@ Cornholio, wasn't talking about you, sorry.

The thing about platformers and shooters is they don't have the same control schemes. Sometimes they don't even have the same jump button. First person shooters literally all have the same controls. I haven't seen an FPS deviate from these controls since the original Xbox and PS2.

Picking control schemes as a point is an odd choice. FPS games have complex controls; is it wrong for such games to find a common language so the player can use past experience in a new game? Also, by that logic it would seem that most shmups are the same because the majority have a bomb button and a shot button.

[sheath]

Space ship shooters are very similar, but the best ones have significant differences in the gameplay thanks to power ups, options and speed settings, not to mention shields. If First Person Shooters allowed even that degree of diversity I would like them more. More importantly to me, if they allowed better physics for tumbling and jumping I would be more entertained by them. It seems like GunValkyrie will remain the most unique third person shooter simply because its failure marked the end of any sort of innovation to the core gameplay mechanics. I can't even play a Transformers game without it playing just like hundreds of other games .

[Mr Smith]

If you look at the first person shooter genere even from Wolfstein then to Doom then to Duke Nukem 3D and so on, each expanded and bought something new to the genere, slowly raising the bar higher. I am struggling to think of any modern console FPS that raises the bar higher than Goldeneye - a game that was pretty damn close to perfection.

To say they are all the same is perhaps an exaggeration, but to say they have improved is another matter.

[Breetai]

Goldeneye? Really? Do ANY of you realize that Zero Tolerance came way before Goldeneye?

[Genesis Knight]

Space ship shooters are very similar, but the best ones have significant differences in the gameplay thanks to power ups, options and speed settings, not to mention shields. If First Person Shooters allowed even that degree of diversity I would like them more. More importantly to me, if they allowed better physics for tumbling and jumping I would be more entertained by them. It seems like GunValkyrie will remain the most unique third person shooter simply because its failure marked the end of any sort of innovation to the core gameplay mechanics. I can't even play a Transformers game without it playing just like hundreds of other games .

"Significant" is an interesting word - if speed settings and shields are enough to differentiate shmups, are plasmids from Bioshock, floaty physics and uniquely-propertied weapons from Halo, real-world bullet drop and heavy recoil from Battlefield, and environmental scoring from Bulletstorm not enough to differentiate those?

If you're interested in jumping and tumbling, give Mirror's Edge a go - you'd probably enjoy it.

I'm not sure how we got on Third Person Shooters with GunValkyrie (good game) and then Transformers... However, Vanquish is an example of a fantastic (and very recent) modern third person shooter. Transformers games are poor licensed crap in the great tradition of the 16-bit days.

If you look at the first person shooter genere even from Wolfstein then to Doom then to Duke Nukem 3D and so on, each expanded and bought something new to the genere, slowly raising the bar higher. I am struggling to think of any modern console FPS that raises the bar higher than Goldeneye - a game that was pretty damn close to perfection.

To say they are all the same is perhaps an exaggeration, but to say they have improved is another matter.

Just as Goldeneye was the first playable multiplayer console FPS, the original Halo was a generational step that proved it was possible to have an FPS on consoles that handled even better than its PC counterparts. Half-Life 2 elevated storytelling in the genre to a new level. Bioshock brought out a level of strategic complexity and an unparalleled sense of place (Rapture). Crysis and Far Cry brought the genre out of corridors and showed how fascinating open-world gameplay could be. Have you played any of these?

Goldeneye? Really? Do ANY of you realize that Zero Tolerance came way before Goldeneye?

Yup, and Doom, and Wolf3D.

[gamevet]

The reason I love Sega-16 is that is most threads are derailed on the first page and two forum member often take the subject so seriously they end up writing a post that takes a couple of hours to read - you can just feel the passion resonating from a subject nobody cares about.

All modern FPS are simply reworkings of the original Goldeneye - they take all the elements that made that game so utterly amazing, do their own graphics, name the weapons differently and it still never turns out as good.

Come-on!

Medal of Honor is where that genre came from. Goldneneye had it's place on consoles, but it was Rainbow 6 and Medal of Honor that influenced the genre.

[Kamahl]

The last FPS that I played to death was Halo: Combat Evolved. The Single Player campaign and the story had me hooked for hours. The sequels, not so much.

There's another person in this world that thinks the first halo was the best?! Mind = Blown.
Loved Halo:CE, Halo 2 was just weak, 3 was uninspired, and Reach was lame but entertaining.

[segaddict]

I picked up both BF3 and MW3, and enjoy them a lot with my friends. I just don't talk about them here, since it's a retro site and retro gamers are good at throwing (humorously) over-the-top hate at modern franchises. I do, however, talk about it over at NeoGAF.

^This. I'm not a huge CoD fan, but I admit I have fun with the games. The campaigns are usually a blast to play. Multiplayer is fun for a little while then it gets too repetitive. I don't know why so many people feel the need to bash the game. I guess because they see the huge hype and sales it gets and that frustrates them since they don't understand why.

I like many different types of games and I'm a very non-bias gamer. I could care less what the general opinion of a game is or about the reviews or sales it gets. I'm gonna play what I enjoy regardless.

[sheath]

"Significant" is an interesting word - if speed settings and shields are enough to differentiate shmups, are plasmids from Bioshock, floaty physics and uniquely-propertied weapons from Halo, real-world bullet drop and heavy recoil from Battlefield, and environmental scoring from Bulletstorm not enough to differentiate those?

If you're interested in jumping and tumbling, give Mirror's Edge a go - you'd probably enjoy it.

These tweaks differentiate the games sure, I just don't think it makes them as different as, say, MUSHA and Raiden Project, it's more like the differences between Thunder Force III and Gradius. I don't like the first person perspective or first person controls, I can't even enjoy Portal because of that, and that is why I brought up the Transformers games (thinking mainly of War for Cybertron and Armada on PS2). It would be impossible for me to enjoy Mirror's edge because of this and the double whammy of it having an E and an A on the cover.

I'm not sure how we got on Third Person Shooters with GunValkyrie (good game) and then Transformers... However, Vanquish is an example of a fantastic (and very recent) modern third person shooter. Transformers games are poor licensed crap in the great tradition of the 16-bit days.

Yeah, I don't think licensed games have gotten any better since the 16-bit days. I'll have to take a look at Vanquish. As I mentioned, Transformers War for Cybertron and the Melbourne House developed PS2 game are actually pretty good, but they play just like FPS in robot modes.

[Cornholio857]

There's another person in this world that thinks the first halo was the best?! Mind = Blown.
Loved Halo:CE, Halo 2 was just weak, 3 was uninspired, and Reach was lame but entertaining.

Yep, that's why I'm looking forward to Halo Anniversary. You can also change the graphics on the fly. Between original and updated. There's also an option to use the original OST or the updated one.

[sheath]

I've been meaning to find out if Halo Anniversary was going to be "updated" in gameplay in any way. I'd hate to have to deal with dual wielding or any of the other additions of later Halo games. Combat Evolved is such a concise experience with nice and tidy little battles that make me think strategically every time. I'm not even sure I'd change the graphics really.