Did the Wii U launch fall flat on its face?

[kool kitty89]

I never said it was the problem, or that the architecture mattered. I've said by that by switching to the AMD APUs & GPUs, the losses on hardware would likely end quicker and keep costs down since they're tooled up and fabricating them on a massive scale for the PC market anyway. Trekkies thinks it's an argument all about programming, whereas it's really all about creating a high-performance and standard environment that pleases developers. That's all that matters, and that's what Nintendo didn't follow through on.

I rather doubt it. The GPU the WiiU is using (from the specs I've seen) looks like a relatively low-cost GPU as it is (core config seems similar to a 5550 or 6530D -clock rate and process match the 5550 too). The CPU die being used is absolutely tiny too (GPU dwarfs it on the MCM).

I really doubt using an APU would have been cheaper overall . . . in fact it would probably be more expensive unless Nintendo dropped Wii compatibility and used a relatively gimped APU model that fell into the similar power consumption range as the WiiU. (otherwise bigger PSU, bulkier case, larger heatsink/fan(s), etc -some of which are more aesthetic issues than actual cost)
As it is, Nitnendo seems to have cut the CPU clock rate due either to aesthetics (small size) and/or cost reasons (same as above), so going APU shouldn't have been a deal breaker one way or the other.

From what I understand, the big added cost for the Wii U is with that game pad, and that's the real deal breaker here. Dropping that would have massively reduced the console's practical retail price, and perhaps allowed for more leeway in terms of actual hardware performance too. (be it using an AMD CPU/APU or a faster IBM one -maybe a beefier GPU too) For that matter, they could have added more modest features like an upgraded nunchuck with additional motion sensors. (or just dual-wielding wii remotes -gimmicky, but could be interesting for some things, including some hack and slash RPGs and adventure games or even shooters, especially with dual pointers)

Perhaps they should have held off longer on the gamepad idea and pushed ahead with the motion-plus capable wii remote as the main controller initially to save costs. (and maybe bump up the internal hardware performance) They could have kept going with the features and gimmicks the wii established, but with reasonably modern hardware and more refined usage of those gimmicks/features. That, and, again, they should have done this sooner. (or, really, anyone should have done this sooner -seriously, a next-gen console in 2010 could have really cut into the market . . . if anyone wanted to push fantasies like "The Return of Sega," that would have been a pretty feasible time to do it)

For 2012 though, they really needed beefier hardware than what they put out. With developers strangled by the aging limited 360 and PS3, a half-decent new console (at least close to a good budget build gaming PC) would have been something really interesting and compelling to a big chunk of developers. And with the established special features and gimmicks of the Wii carried over, there'd be potential to work that in too.

I see everybody jumping to one standard, pressure from most of the industry will be on AMD's driver support of DX11 & OpenGL. Developers will get used to having a powerful environment they can easily port their games around in, with the Xbox Durango, Playstation 4, and PC-Steambox. Development on Wii U, will be more cumbersome and expensive than any of it's competitors. Nintendo will probably need to burden themselves with the costs of outside development, and on top of already eating the price cuts at retailers, it's no wonder the media is squawking about how bad things are.

If higher-end ARM/Android based game platforms appear (perhaps Project Shield) that may change things somewhat too, not to mention potential shift towards open-source platforms given the questionable direction MS's current OS platforms are going (at least once Win7 starts becoming less mainstream). Albeit, OpenGL would probably be the main API on such platforms too. (or pretty much any major standard outside of MS's stuff -which have OpenGL support too, of course)

There's no technical reason the Wii U couldn't support OpenGL too, but the actual performance bottlenecks would still be there.

[JCU]

Why isn't GTA V coming to the Wii U?

Has that been confirmed yet?

GTA IV (along with the 2 expansions) has issues on the 360. What would a larger, more detailed version be like on the Wii U?

[The Jackal]

GTA IV (along with the 2 expansions) has issues on the 360.

What issues? The game was pretty solid last time I played it.

[gamevet]

Has that been confirmed yet?

There would be a pre-order available for the Wii U, if the game was being shipped for the console. It'll probably hit PC before that happens.

http://www.rockstargames.com/V/

GTA IV (along with the 2 expansions) has issues on the 360. What would a larger, more detailed version be like on the Wii U?

The game played fine on the 360. The PS3 version is a little blurry in comparison to the 360 game.

[Vector2013]

WiiU. The current Jaguar.

[MrSega]

WiiU. The current Jaguar.

More like, the Atari 5200.

[JCU]

The game played fine on the 360. The PS3 version is a little blurry in comparison to the 360 game.

Fine huh?

Blurry seems to be an appropriate description for that on the 360. Should I feel as if I am playing the game while wearing a pair of vasoline covered glasses? When's the last time you played TLAD? I don't know about you but I always love when parts of a street block do not appear until you are next to them or the buildings in an entire block are dark and only light up until you are right on top of them.

The game plays quite well but it certainly is not void of hangups and such.

[gamevet]

Fine huh?

Blurry seems to be an appropriate description for that on the 360. Should I feel as if I am playing the game while wearing a pair of vasoline covered glasses? When's the last time you played TLAD? I don't know about you but I always love when parts of a street block do not appear until you are next to them or the buildings in an entire block are dark and only light up until you are right on top of them.

The game plays quite well but it certainly is not void of hangups and such.

You blurry part is the far off city, and it comes into focus as you get closer to it. I just popped it into my 360 and drove a fake Camaro for several miles around the city. I could clearly see road signs about the same as when I'm driving in real life. It looks fine in (err 720p) 1080p.

The PC game will actually put a stangle hold on lesser hardware, because of how demanding the game is. I've heard that the high res texture mod has burned up its fair share of video cards.

[KitsuneNight]

WiiU. The current Jaguar.

the wii u isnt that bad yet
the jaguar was garbage the wii u is ...is...well its not garbage yet

[JCU]

You blurry part is the far off city, and it comes into focus as you get closer to it. I just popped it into my 360 and drove a fake Camaro for several miles around the city. I could clearly see road signs about the same as when I'm driving in real life. It looks fine in (err 720p) 1080p.

The PC game will actually put a stangle hold on lesser hardware, because of how demanding the game is. I've heard that the high res texture mod has burned up its fair share of video cards.

Something like which you describe is normal and generally accepted. Buildings that were once far away gradually come into focus the closer you get. Certain effects are experienced (lights coming on) the closer you get. The screen becoming "blurry" as you are speeding through traffic is common.

When I play TLAD and have to literally be next to the wannabe Bank of America building before it comes into focus I think there is a problem. Same thing as I mentioned with an entire block lighting up when you stop. Certain things are a bit off kilter. I'd expect that from such a taxing game though. I have yet to see if TBOGT has any of the same issues.

Still though, if the talk is true about the Wii U being a small step above the current 360/PS3 I can't imagine GTA V running very smoothly on it. If you want to talk about demanding, I think V looks to be the definition of the word.

[gamevet]

Something like which you describe is normal and generally accepted. Buildings that were once far away gradually come into focus the closer you get. Certain effects are experienced (lights coming on) the closer you get. The screen becoming "blurry" as you are speeding through traffic is common.

When I play TLAD and have to literally be next to the wannabe Bank of America building before it comes into focus I think there is a problem. Same thing as I mentioned with an entire block lighting up when you stop. Certain things are a bit off kilter. I'd expect that from such a taxing game though. I have yet to see if TBOGT has any of the same issues.

What system are you playing The Lost & Damned on?

I've played GTAIV on the 360 and had no issues with it. I then played TLAD on the PS3 and felt that it looked like ass in comparison to the 360 game. Are the issues with the PS3 version, also present on the 360 version of TLAD? I would have thought that it would perform the same as the original GTAIV, since they are running on the same game engine. I figured the issues with the PS3 version of TLAD had to do with the limited VRAM of the PS3 (256 MB vs 512 MB for the 360).

Still though, if the talk is true about the Wii U being a small step above the current 360/PS3 I can't imagine GTA V running very smoothly on it. If you want to talk about demanding, I think V looks to be the definition of the word.

Even though the Wii U is slightly more powerful (in theory) than the PS3 and 360, it still has to stream video to the pad. I believe that the fact that the Wii U has to spend resources to steam video the the gamepad takes away most of the hardware advantages it has over the PS3 and 360.

This video shows a comparison of the 360, PS3 and Wii U playing Mass Effect 3. The 360 version clearly has the most solid frame-rate of the 3 consoles, with the PS3 taking the biggest hit. Yeah, Mass Effect 3 was designed around the 360 hardware, but the Wii U's hardware should be at an advantage here, with its better CPU and VRAM.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EopiqKacEP0

[KitsuneNight]

i really dont see any difference in that clip

then again i dont really care much about graphics and you have to point the percieved differences out to me with huge letters and diagrams and pointy arrows
lots of pointy arrows

[Segadream]

I agree , when did graphics take over as making a good game or system?
I think since wii has virtual console that Nintendo should invest in new retro based games for snes and the like.
Considering how much better and longer games could potentially be, alas its getting light out and I may still be dreaming..... that its up to us to hack the games Nintendo should still be making.
Its pretty sad when companies that are still up and going let a console die from not making games for it.
seems like they could make money like this though. But unless its a sega im not buying any new system ever again. (I think the computers are going to make "new" consoles extinct very soon anyhow.)
All they were and to some point still are,(for the most part) are idiot proof computers that are designed for gaming purposes.
It was ok when computers were new and not many people knew how to use them, but now a 2 year old has access to the iphone and whatnot.
Im really gonna be just like cranky kong in my latter years, or that granpa from the super Mario rpg commercial.

[KitsuneNight]

I agree , when did graphics take over as making a good game or system?:

honestly ?
always
the graphics are just getting better and better but even back in the 90's we'd argue about which graphics were better even if they are now crude lego building blocks

[Segadream]

If we ever learn anything from video games I hope its that the pictures don't have to be realistic as long as you know what its supposed to be.
I know Atari was really trying but the nes/master and up pretty much accomplished this.
And I would say if any more detail was put into games it would be too real.
I must have gotten old cuz I know it mattered then and its surpassed what I feel is now too far.
No real need to make the video game a video.
Where is the fantasy when it looks like reality?
How do you immerse yourself into a game that looks like a movie?
They do look pretty.But I think the heart of gaming suffers when that's all that matters.