Sonic the Hedgehog Remake announced - 60fps goodness using the retro engine

[TrekkiesUnite118]

The port of Toshinden was handled in house by Sega wasn't it?

[MrSega]

Naka was an idiot to keep the NiGHTS engine for himself. He should have been thinking about what was best for the company, but instead he was holed up in his office jerking off and playing NiGHTS.

I honestly don't believe it would have made much of a difference. Xtreme was a project doomed from the start. Everything about it screamed "Impending BAD execution" & Tiara Booboski is probably the WORST game character I have heard of in my entire life.

She was such a blatant dead ringer for Princess Sally.

[TheSonicRetard]

The port of Toshinden was handled in house by Sega wasn't it?

No idea.

[Da_Shocker]

Presumably because tecmos relationship with sega was better than takara's. Sega had already licensed out the model 2 hardware for the arcade version of doa. Itagaki was, and still is, a big sega fan.

It wasn't just Takara though I mean look at Final Fight Revenge. I mean I do recall Anarchy In The Nippon using the VF2 engine. But Sega didn't seem to give a fuck whqat crap the 3rd parties were churning out as long as they paid there licensing fees.

[bultje112]

I wanted a game that was revamped for the Saturn that took full advantage of the Saturn's vast 2D capabilities. The difference between Sonic Jam and the Genesis versions are negligible at best.

sonic jam was just a port of the old sonic games for saturn. it was never intended to be graphically enhanced.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

It should probably also be mentioned that just because a game uses the same engine as another, doesn't mean it will automatically be as good as the other game. So it's possible that other games did use the VF2 engine but since they obviously didn't have the same care and effort put in as VF2 the end result obviously wasn't as good.

[Vector2013]

Naka pulling the NiGHTS engine created a domino effect that doomed the company. It's well documented.

It's also well documented that other things doomed the company. A fucking game engine was nothing compared to more higher up bad decisions. You already made 2 incorrect assumptions about me since I signed up here, care to make a 3rd ?

[Da_Shocker]

sonic jam was just a port of the old sonic games for saturn. it was never intended to be graphically enhanced.

I know what it's intentions were that doesn't mean that Sega couldn't have actually put sum time and effort into makin them something special. The only purpose Sonic Jam serves to me is the convience of having all the game wrapped in one single disc. Otherwise I can pop my Genesis games in and have a better experience.

[Da_Shocker]

It should probably also be mentioned that just because a game uses the same engine as another, doesn't mean it will automatically be as good as the other game. So it's possible that other games did use the VF2 engine but since they obviously didn't have the same care and effort put in as VF2 the end result obviously wasn't as good.

Outside of Anarchy in Nippon and DoA what other fighting games even bear a slight semblance to VF2?

[TheSonicRetard]

It's also well documented that other things doomed the company. A fucking game engine was nothing compared to more higher up bad decisions. You already made 2 incorrect assumptions about me since I signed up here, care to make a 3rd ?

Well documented by who? Arm chair analysts like yourself? It should be pretty evident by now that I speak to people within the company both past and present.

This is a subject I'm pretty familiar with.

[TheSonicRetard]

I know what it's intentions were that doesn't mean that Sega couldn't have actually put sum time and effort into makin them something special. The only purpose Sonic Jam serves to me is the convience of having all the game wrapped in one single disc. Otherwise I can pop my Genesis games in and have a better experience.

There is this assumption that the games are straight genesis binaries and that Sonic Jam is nothing more than a hack job that was rushed. That couldn't be further from the truth. They're actually source ports running on the SH2s inside the saturn. People assume that they're running on the m68k when they aren't.

There was quite a bit of effort that went into Sonic Jam to get it the way it works. The Saturn certainly couldn't emulate the genesis. This ignores the litany of features exclusive to Sonic Jam that have never been seen since. 3 level variations per game, for example - Easy, Normal, and Original.

For years, Sonic Jam was the gold standard for compilations. It's still better than most compilation disks. For what it was, I feel like Sonic Jam was awesome.

[TheSonicRetard]

I honestly don't believe it would have made much of a difference. Xtreme was a project doomed from the start. Everything about it screamed "Impending BAD execution" & Tiara Booboski is probably the WORST game character I have heard of in my entire life.

She was such a blatant dead ringer for Princess Sally.

How could it scream "Bad execution" from the start when it was never executed? The game had like 4 false starts. They never completed an alpha build of any engine. All work anyone ever sees for the game is preliminary work. We barely have any idea what the game was going to be like, and the initial design documents for the game are wildly different from what actually wound up being created.

I'm not saying Sonic Xtreme was ever going to be anything great. But the lack of Sonic in any form on the Saturn, especially during the crucial 1996 holiday season, sunk the saturn. A sonic game, even a disappointing one, would have kept the system in the public consciousness.

I mean, consider that THIS is how the game was pitched:



Before anyone asks - that is simply an animation created on an Amiga 1200 by Chris Senn. This was never a playable game.

EDIT: That pitch is the infamous video that Yuji Naka watched and shook his head at, and said "Good luck" to the team

He never believed they could pull something like that off. I guess he was technically right.

[Da_Shocker]

There is this assumption that the games are straight genesis binaries and that Sonic Jam is nothing more than a hack job that was rushed. That couldn't be further from the truth. They're actually source ports running on the SH2s inside the saturn. People assume that they're running on the m68k when they aren't.

There was quite a bit of effort that went into Sonic Jam to get it the way it works. The Saturn certainly couldn't emulate the genesis. This ignores the litany of features exclusive to Sonic Jam that have never been seen since. 3 level variations per game, for example - Easy, Normal, and Original.

For years, Sonic Jam was the gold standard for compilations. It's still better than most compilation disks. For what it was, I feel like Sonic Jam was awesome.

Where did I say that they were emulated games? And really who gives a fuck about those minor level variations. Hell i'd take playing Knuckles and Tails in Sonic 1 over that shit. There still terrible slowdown in all of the games. And the music is still off. Sega could've easily fixed all of these issues. No they want to give us a 3D world and those ho hum boring ass Japanese commercials. YAWN.

[TheSonicRetard]

Where did I say that they were emulated games? And really who gives a fuck about those minor level variations. Hell i'd take playing Knuckles and Tails in Sonic 1 over that shit. There still terrible slowdown in all of the games. And the music is still off. Sega could've easily fixed all of these issues. No they want to give us a 3D world and those ho hum boring ass Japanese commercials. YAWN.

Where did I say YOU said they were emulation? I was dispelling your ignorant claim that they were effortless ports - a notion you still have in your head considering you claim the faults with the game could be "easily" fixed. What sort of basis do you have to make such a claim?

I don't really know what your end game is. It seems like you're just raging because the game doesn't hold up to some sort of imagined standards you have. That's fine that it didn't meet your expectations, but your vitriol at what the game actually wound up being is eye rollingly lame.

[Da_Shocker]

Where did I say YOU said they were emulation? I was dispelling your ignorant claim that they were effortless ports - a notion you still have in your head considering you claim the faults with the game could be "easily" fixed. What sort of basis do you have to make such a claim?

I don't really know what your end game is. It seems like you're just raging because the game doesn't hold up to some sort of imagined standards you have. That's fine that it didn't meet your expectations, but your vitriol at what the game actually wound up being is eye rollingly lame.

There fuckin ports that look EXACTLY the same and prun EXACTLY the same as the Genesis version that is why. I thought this game was mediocre effort back in 97 and remains to be an mediocre effort in 2013. It's only a bit better than that garbage that Sega churned out with the Smashpack. Considering Sega's awful marketing position in 97 churning out 4 rehashed Genesis was very very smart.