So I gave Mario 64 another try over the weekend...

[Black_Tiger]

I prefer SNES Starfox "voice acting" to real Starfox voice acting, just as Valis III Genesis/MD "voice acting" is so effective.

[Soulis]

I don't know, i never had any major issues with Mario 64 camera, i understand that some people may had issues with it at some parts but saying its downright "awful" and throwing away the game for it is questionable.

[FuturePrimitive]

^Both of those make me want to poke my eardrums out, actually. The Mario one is inevitably more annoying in the short term because you're pounding down every sound in the game consecutively, but the Sonic one makes me feel like my personal space is being invaded by a furry who smells like stale Cheetos.

Ha! Rep for you. Quote of the day maybe.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

I don't know, i never had any major issues with Mario 64 camera, i understand that some people may had issues with it at some parts but saying its downright "awful" and throwing away the game for it is questionable.

Oh I'm not throwing the game away for just the camera. It's also because the boringly repetitive gameplay, the gimmick of extending the game by making you replay the same levels over and over again, the inaccurate controls, etc.

[Knuckle Duster]

I can't take Trekkies arguments in this thread seriously. It's one thing to shit on Mario 64 for being overrated. It's another thing entirely to put Sonic Adventure on a pedestal.

Sonic Adventure was dog shit from day one. A half broken platformer with fast gameplay and polished graphics.

[Kamahl]

A half broken platformer with fast gameplay and polished graphics.

Even that is debatable, the quality keeps falling as the game goes. The in-game cutscenes really show the extremely low polygon count of the DC.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

I can't take Trekkies arguments in this thread seriously. It's one thing to shit on Mario 64 for being overrated. It's another thing entirely to put Sonic Adventure on a pedestal.

Sonic Adventure was dog shit from day one. A half broken platformer with fast gameplay and polished graphics.

I'm not putting Sonic Adventure on a Pedestal. I realize the game has it's flaws. I'm simply saying Mario 64 has some similar flaws, and in some cases they are worse. Sonic Adventure does have some Camera issues, but for the most part they are a minor inconvenience when they rarely pop up. Mario 64's Camera I have to constantly screw with to try and get something I can work with to make a jump. Sonic Adventure's camera just sometimes get's in the way. Mario 64's camera is almost always in the way.

Both games have Voice acting. Sonic Adventures you only have to put up with during cutscenes. Mario 64's you hear constantly throughout the game. Between the two I'd personlly take the voice acting in Sonic Adventure over Mario 64 as Sonic's voice isn't anywhere near as annoying as Mario's. Sonic Adventure's voice acting while not great isn't bad either. It's passable. So is Mario 64's voice acting, but Mario's grunts, screams, and cries can get annoying fast. In Sonic Adventure the most you will hear Sonic say in a level is "ugh No..." when he dies. In Mario 64 you'll constantly hear Mario going "hoo! Hah! UGH! AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAA! WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH! MAMAMIA! YAHOO! YAYAYAYAYAYAYAHOOO!". It doesn't take rocket science to figure out which one becomes more annoying.

Control wise is the area I feel Sonic Adventure is substantially better. At least on the Dreamcast version. Sonic moves very precisely when running and it's pretty easy to aim and make your jumps. Mario 64 on the other hand feels loose. Trying to make some precise jumps can be difficult and it feels rather inaccurate at times.

Basically I find both to have their flaws and be broken at times. But I find Sonic Adventure to be the more enjoyable game of the two and the one who's flaws don't interfere with my enjoying the game as much. Neither game is perfect or deserves to be on a pedestal. I will however say I rate Sonic Adventure higher than Mario 64.

And if Sonic Adventure was truly dogshit when it came out, then explain why it got excellent reviews:
http://www.gamespot.com/sonic-advent...eview-2540626/

And don't give me that crap of "It was the first Sonic game in years!" There were games like Sonic 3D Blast that had come out in that gap and they didn't get nearly as good of reviews.

[Da_Shocker]

I hated Mario 64 back in 96 but I was a die hard Sega fanboy. I did think that Sonic Adventure was better at one point in time but that was after so many mediocre,strange, and just plain bad games after S&K I couldn't really help myself. At the end of the day I just have a strong distaste for 3D platformers back then. I also thought that the walking stages in NiGHTS were awful. One day I will give Mario 64 a playthrough.

[Black_Tiger]

And if Sonic Adventure was truly dogshit when it came out, then explain why it got excellent reviews:http://www.gamespot.com/sonic-advent...eview-2540626/

Does this really need to be explained, or do you honestly believe that no game has ever been overrated in a review?

Oh I'm not throwing the game away for just the camera. It's also because the boringly repetitive gameplay, the gimmick of extending the game by making you replay the same levels over and over again, the inaccurate controls, etc.

If you don't appreciate Mario 64, that's one thing. But the complaints listed above apply even more so to Sonic Adventure, which goes on to add a bunch or very underwhelming filler.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

Does this really need to be explained, or do you honestly believe that no game has ever been overrated in a review?

Oh I understand a game being overrated in a review, but if a game gets consistently high reviews I'd say that's a safe bet that the general opinion of the game is that it's good. Sonic Adventure DID get consistently high reviews when it came out. The hate Sonic Adventure gets these days seems to stem more from the DX port creating more bugs as well as the Sonic Hate Bandwagon that started with Sonic 2006. When you look at reviews from when it came out in 1999, it was actually pretty well received.

If you don't appreciate Mario 64, that's one thing. But the complaints listed above apply even more so to Sonic Adventure, which goes on to add a bunch or very underwhelming filler.

Replaying the same level over and over again doesn't really apply to Sonic Adventure. One you're not forced to do it, and two when you play through them as the other characters they are actually quite different. It's not like Mario 64 where you walk around the same map only one time you get the Star on your right and the other time you get the Star on your left. Sonic Adventure's gameplay isn't nearly as boring as Mario 64's, and as I've said before, I find the controls for Sonic Adventure on the Dreamcast to be significantly more accurate than the controls for Mario 64.

[Segadream]

Mario 64 had a "bad rep" from day one for me.
The guy I got my first 64 from actually gave it to me when it was still new.
He bought it for star wars but was disappointed with it.
I don't think he was ready for the demanding hand to eye coordination needed to play these games.
He came from older days. Not that pong isn't challenging, but its only up or down and hit and miss.
He then tried star fox and he quotes "I must have really sucked at that game","Cause I swear at one point they actually took away my sights" (not realizing he did this to himself when mashing madly).
Then with Mario 64 he said it sucked cause of how Mario would swim and he couldn't get the camera to do what he thought it should.
Well it was all a positive for me as he literally gave it me(no games) and two controllers.
So when I finally got some games that Christmas I was looking for these "problems" and had a heads up about them.
Well star wars did indeed suck and the only good part was the first stage,But I did enjoy making wompas attack each other.
Star fox was awesome the first 20 times I beat it, and now I know why I liked the first stage of shadows of the empire so much. I figured out what happened with the sights early into it.(Had the same problem when I was playing Mario kart with two players and the sound kept changing on us.)
On Mario 64 I made it a point to master this game. Not only is it great, the official strategy guide is great as well. With it you can tackle harder parts with ease. As for the camera angle problems it never bothered me as I changed angles it if I could or learned what motions I needed to advance with the angles I had been given.
There is nothing wrong with it in my opinion. We as gamers are just too stuck in our old ways as to what it should feel like in our own biased opinions.
Trust me,no sonic game will ever give you that joy you received from the first sonic game you ever played.
With a lot of us this is always too true.(even if you don't like sonic)

[Bottino]

I agree with Trekkies on this one.I find extremally amusing that in a Sega forum, one cannot say that likes/thinks Sonic Adventure better than Mario 64 and, when demonstrates the flaws that he sees in the game, starts a flamewar here because some people just can't accept that. It happened the same thing in that Sonic thread on Genesis Does!.
And to the angry boy there, who said that SA was "dog shit", well maybe you should check on what are you feeding that dog and maybe try to stop eating his food.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

no sonic game will ever give you that joy you received from the first sonic game you ever played.
With a lot of us this is always too true.(even if you don't like sonic)

My first Sonic game was the first one for the Genesis and I honestly think it's the worst one of the original Genesis titles. Hell I'd even put Adventure, Adventure 2, Unleashed, Colors, and Generations ahead of it.

[Soulis]

the inaccurate controls

Nonsense. I guess you think Sonic Adventure's floaty controls are better, right? I bet you do.

Also, lol at the Sonic Adventure reviews. If you think good reviews are a proof for the game's quality then i must remind you about the perfect reviews Mario 64 got. Heck, according to gamerankings its the 7th best game of all time.

[TrekkiesUnite118]

Oh I'm well aware that Mario 64 got great reviews too. I'm not debating that. I'm simply saying I don't like the game for the reasons I've stated above. I'm not saying the game is dogshit like some people are saying about Sonic Adventure.

And yes, I do think Sonic Adventure's controls are better. Yeah when he jumps it's a bit floaty in that he jumps rather slowly, but walking and running around is very precise. You can stop easily on a dime, and it's a bit easier to control where you will jump and land. Mario 64 on the other hand feels loose and imprecise.