Sellers of disc-based games on eBay suck.

[kool kitty89]

Pinholl top scratches aren't disk rot, they're just a scratch that went too deep on the top. Everybody should check for top scratches before selling a disk anyway, it's sad how few people have any idea that the data is on the top of the disk or embedded in the plastic and not on the bottom though.

It's good to note such damages, but it's also still good to test it too . . . both matter. Superficial damage (including pin hole scratches through the label/lacquer) is good to note, but is still just superficial. OTOH, there's those borderline cases where a disc is fine on a number of drives/machines, but flakes out on those with weaker drives. (and, of course, most modern PC drives are going to be far better about that than old consoles or music players for that matter)
Hell, don't forget the mess Pier Solar ran into over their pressed CDs for the first edition releases . . . perfectly acceptable for modern drives and even for CD-DA, but not acceptable for data usage on many Sega CDs. (copying and burning to CD-R solves that though . . . but you can't do that to systems with disc security)

There's also the separate issue of top scratches potentially leading to real disc rot . . . or something functionally identical to it. Holes small enough to not cause read errors can still lead to oxidation/corrosion that may later lead to general failure.


Oh, and of course, these problems don't apply to DVDs at all, since they're sandwiched rather than lacquer coated. (so only bottom scratches or actual cracks matter)




Also note that it takes some experience to know how to pick out a real lacquer hole scratch vs just flaws in the metal layer of the disc. (quite a few -especially old- CDs I've seen are peppered with little pin hole sized flaws where the metalized layer is thinner or even perpherated) Those flaws shouldn't be a problem and, unlike actual surface holes, can't lead to "rot" either. (corrosion)

[Ninsega]

From what I've heard, that's exactly what eBay does unfortunately...

Ninsega is only contributing to that problem. :/

Maybe because I am a buyer and not a seller. Maybe you should be the same instead of unloading your busted up shit for a premium price? Hmm?

[TrekkiesUnite118]

Maybe because I am a buyer and not a seller. Maybe you should be the same instead of unloading your busted up shit for a premium price? Hmm?

If the game still works perfectly and all the data is there it's not busted up shit, it's just used. And if it's an auction we're not the ones unloading it for a premium price. The buyers are the ones naming their own price in that scenario.

Looking at that MMX4 auction, I've got to say a lot of it seems to be more of your responsibility. You saw the game was a former rental (Blockbuster stickers on the disc). That should tell you right away that the disc has probably seen better days. Any experienced collector would have drawn similar conclusions. It's one of the main reasons I tend to avoid former rentals of disc based games.

Yet you say sellers are unloading their busted crap at premium prices, so surely this must have been a BIN and the seller asked for $70 right? Nope, it was an Auction. You named your own price. You decided that $70 for a former rental that probably has a beat up disc was a fair price. If the game still works, it's exactly as described as the rest of the packaging appears to be in great condition.

But oh wait, this only gets better. You say the seller had tons of positive feedback. But looking at his feedback he only has 9 entries. All are positive but 8 of those are as a buyer, not a seller. You took a risk and should have known what you were getting into. The seller didn't try to fool you, you just chose to ignore the warning signs. Now you're upset that you made a mistake and are lashing out at sellers.

[Ninsega]

And that is why Buyer Protection is there to save the day

[TrekkiesUnite118]

And that is why Buyer Protection is there to save the day

I guess buyers do need to be protected from their own incompetence.

The Seller didn't do anything wrong in this case. He described it to the best of his knowledge on the subject, and confirmed the game worked and showed you in pictures that it was a former rental. The case condition from the auction looks to be in great condition as well. Could he have been more descriptive? Sure. But if you were worried about pinholes in the disc, you should have asked the seller to look for them before buying, since he clearly didn't know to look for them. The seller didn't try to scam you or mislead you. If the game still works, it's exactly as described.

[Blades]

Of potentially integral data, which is now permanently missing.

You are aware of redundancy?

What did you think he meant when he wrote "Some light scratches on the game disc"? I think you're being unreasonable.

[tz101]

Yeah, it wasn't oxidation that was supposed to cause discs to "rot" in the first place. The simple passing of the laser across the disc or time alone will cause it to happen faster than the properties of the metal in general. We aren't talking about the metal turning into carbon or disintegrating, it just has to lose the properties necessary to hold all of those 0s and 1s properly. 20-30 years is all that takes.

So, are you saying that the repetitive heat that the aluminum data layer is subjected to takes its toll over 20-30 years? If so, then most of my shelved games will last eternity because they mostly do not get played.

There's also the separate issue of top scratches potentially leading to real disc rot . . . or something functionally identical to it. Holes small enough to not cause read errors can still lead to oxidation/corrosion that may later lead to general failure.

Also note that it takes some experience to know how to pick out a real lacquer hole scratch vs just flaws in the metal layer of the disc. (quite a few -especially old- CDs I've seen are peppered with little pin hole sized flaws where the metalized layer is thinner or even perpherated) Those flaws shouldn't be a problem and, unlike actual surface holes, can't lead to "rot" either. (corrosion)

The real risk is less than your chances of winning the powerball. A minute amount of oxygen reaching a bit or two of 0's and 1's in a disc's data layer could cause oxidation over years, but would really require a catalyst such as water to get the process rolling. As long as you don't store your game discs in a soggy basement, don't lose any sleep over this one.

[kool kitty89]

So, are you saying that the repetitive heat that the aluminum data layer is subjected to takes its toll over 20-30 years? If so, then most of my shelved games will last eternity because they mostly do not get played.



The real risk is less than your chances of winning the powerball. A minute amount of oxygen reaching a bit or two of 0's and 1's in a disc's data layer could cause oxidation over years, but would really require a catalyst such as water to get the process rolling. As long as you don't store your game discs in a soggy basement, don't lose any sleep over this one.

Might be more of a problem for people living in areas like Florida with super high humidity.