PS2 vs Dreamcast Graphics

[Yharnamresident]

I will be posting a full Naomi game, I have to do it after learning all this.

[Loggo]

Naomi 2 is essentially a "Dreamcast Pro".

Both have the same GPU, but Naomi 2 has two of them. As I understand it, in Naomi 2 each GPU is responsible for rendering one side of the screen, so I assume you have to send the same geometry twice.

More importantly, though, Naomi 2 "fixes" Dreamcast’s Achilles heel by adding dedicated silicon for T&L (the ELAN coprocessor). So, much like the PS2/GC/XBOX, you don’t have to do T&L on the CPU anymore. It not only can do a much better job at "feeding" the GPU(s), it can do this while freeing the SH4 to focus its resources on game logic tasks. Factor in the massive increase in RAM and the fact that ELAN allows for a minimum of 6 (!!!) simultaneous lights at absolutely no performance cost (!!!) to polygon-throughput and the gap gets even wider…

It would have been amazing to have ELAN in DC (it was "tailor-made" for DC’s GPU, after all). A dual SH4 setup would have been cool as well (and probably much cheaper than ELAN). Just having some sort of dedicated hardware for T&L would have been a game changer in terms of performance. Personally speaking (and always in hindsight), I would have traded the built-in modem for a dual SH4 setup + more RAM… in a heartbeat. Not that it would have changed the outcome or anything (DC’s demise had nothing to do with the hardware anyway), it just would have been cooler to have :P

[Leynos]

Yeah if it had that extra chip. While we are dreaming up a scenario of improving DC hardware.
Taking SEGA financials out of it.

I'd want 24MB of main ram in addition to the 8MB of Vram.
Dual Analog controller
Saturn Dpad
6 buttons
DVD Drive
Modem Still included.
1999 Launch in both US and Japan.

[Yharnamresident]

Naomi 2 is essentially a "Dreamcast Pro".

Both have the same GPU, but Naomi 2 has two of them. As I understand it, in Naomi 2 each GPU is responsible for rendering one side of the screen, so I assume you have to send the same geometry twice.

More importantly, though, Naomi 2 "fixes" Dreamcast’s Achilles heel by adding dedicated silicon for T&L (the ELAN coprocessor). So, much like the PS2/GC/XBOX, you don’t have to do T&L on the CPU anymore. It not only can do a much better job at "feeding" the GPU(s), it can do this while freeing the SH4 to focus its resources on game logic tasks. Factor in the massive increase in RAM and the fact that ELAN allows for a minimum of 6 (!!!) simultaneous lights at absolutely no performance cost (!!!) to polygon-throughput and the gap gets even wider…

It would have been amazing to have ELAN in DC (it was "tailor-made" for DC’s GPU, after all). A dual SH4 setup would have been cool as well (and probably much cheaper than ELAN). Just having some sort of dedicated hardware for T&L would have been a game changer in terms of performance. Personally speaking (and always in hindsight), I would have traded the built-in modem for a dual SH4 setup + more RAM… in a heartbeat. Not that it would have changed the outcome or anything (DC’s demise had nothing to do with the hardware anyway), it just would have been cooler to have :P

What I don't like about playing Naomi 2 is I can tell theres no way the Dreamcast could handle the graphics. Like Giga Wing 2 on Naomi is the exact same as the Dreamcast version as far as I can tell, and Dead or Alive 2 was only slightly changed.

[SegaAMD]

Attachment 16507

Attachment 16508

Attachment 16509

Attachment 16510

As we can see the PS2 has textures and filters infinite times superior to the N64. In THPS3 the N64 has the worst texture maps and draw distance, in WinBack (an advanced game by N64 standards) the PS2 version is literally a generation up in textures just like ArmyMen Sarge Heroes 2. Super Mario 64 source code leaked and someone ported the game to PS2, as we can see the graphics are the same but filtering and resolution make the ps2 version better.

The racing game is called Ubisoft's F1 Racing Championship (2000) is a multiplatform game released for PC, PS1, DC, PS2 and N64. The PC version is the best but is very demanding requiring a Geforce 2 for 1024x768 resolution, N64 version again has the worst texture maps.

[Yharnamresident]

Attachment 16507

Attachment 16508

Attachment 16509

Attachment 16510

As we can see the PS2 has textures and filters infinite times superior to the N64. In THPS3 the N64 has the worst texture maps and draw distance, in WinBack (an advanced game by N64 standards) the PS2 version is literally a generation up in textures just like ArmyMen Sarge Heroes 2. Super Mario 64 source code leaked and someone ported the game to PS2, as we can see the graphics are the same but filtering and resolution make the ps2 version better.

The racing game is called Ubisoft's F1 Racing Championship (2000) is a multiplatform game released for PC, PS1, DC, PS2 and N64. The PC version is the best but is very demanding requiring a Geforce 2 for 1024x768 resolution, N64 version again has the worst texture maps.

Try using a file host if you cant get attachments working

[Joe Redifer]

This is the first time I've seen this thread.

The PlayStation 2 wins at most things when it comes to graphics.

/endthread

[gamevet]

That's sage advice Joe!

[Yharnamresident]

This is the first time I've seen this thread.

The PlayStation 2 wins at most things when it comes to graphics.

/endthread

Yes that is the case, Mr. famous YouTube person

[SegaAMD]

https://i.imgur.com/DD0rawH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sPYYV3o.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/meRUkuS.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OCbyBs5.jpg

[SegaAMD]

This is the first time I've seen this thread.

The PlayStation 2 wins at most things when it comes to graphics.

/endthread

Keep participating, some users suggest the possibility of the Dreamcast being very close to the PS2 others believe that the PS2 can contain the Dreamcast 100% inside. It is very encouraging to see different opinions. By the way, don't you know anyone at Sega? I mean I follow the philosophy that if we want new products from the company we will have to demand it, we cannot remain passive while it only launches products in Japan, and yes I know that it is not the same Sega etc but I confess that I am enthusiastic about this thesis.

[Leynos]

https://i.imgur.com/DD0rawH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sPYYV3o.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/meRUkuS.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OCbyBs5.jpg

[Yharnamresident]

https://i.imgur.com/DD0rawH.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/sPYYV3o.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/meRUkuS.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/OCbyBs5.jpg

Are you messing with us? I've seen you posting pictures properly before









If people are saying the PS2 has bad textures they are saying relatively speaking, compared to its main competitors. Its still a lot more advanced than N64. Like Airforce Delta has low polycounts for a Dreamcast game, its still running at 7x what you'd see on PS1/N64(which is 80,000 PPS).

[Yharnamresident]

Keep participating, some users suggest the possibility of the Dreamcast being very close to the PS2 others believe that the PS2 can contain the Dreamcast 100% inside. It is very encouraging to see different opinions. By the way, don't you know anyone at Sega? I mean I follow the philosophy that if we want new products from the company we will have to demand it, we cannot remain passive while it only launches products in Japan, and yes I know that it is not the same Sega etc but I confess that I am enthusiastic about this thesis.

Its not as close to the PS2 as the 360 is to the PS3, but a bit closer than the PS2 compared to OG Xbox.

[SegaAMD]

If people are saying the PS2 has bad textures they are saying relatively speaking, compared to its main competitors. Its still a lot more advanced than N64.

Thank you for posting the pictures. Actually I was able to post images before but I don't know if the forum has been updated, because the way I used to do it no longer works.

I believe they don't speak in a relative way, I believe they are unaware of PS2 games. Compared to its main competitors, for example, it is possible to read the old content Sega-16 internet is eternal, I don't know if the user changed his mind but that user sheath (he is probably reading he posted on the previous page) until then believed that the PS2 had the worst texture maps sixth genI invite him to explain these games here:














I'm going to use the same method you used and see if it works. Cool I see it worked, at least the image is visible to me.

let me explain the captures, they are captures coming from comparatives like DF and others. What's the point? We know that the Dreamcast has good textures and we know that some say ps2 has bad textures to the point of disparaging comparison to the N64. So I ask if the PS2 can be compared in textures to the N64 so what can I compare the textures of Evil Twin or Half Life ? NFL2k2, NBA 2Night ? The PS2 started to officially support progressive scan in March 2002, so previous games naturally didn't have it but look when using GSM in games like RECV we have comparable quality the differences in aesthetics are due to the greenish tones provided by the ps2's lighting while the Dreamcast version has reddish tones yehthere is an advantage but it is too small to be observed it can be reduced to the way each hardware renders, because the character textures are in identical 256x256, in other games like Unreal Tournament the textures have the same resolution 128x128 128x64 and details with aggravating effect of the Dreamcast having inferior and flat lighting - the same situation as Sega Bass 2 - . In virtua tennis 2 PS2 version has a filter that leaves it smooth, while the DC version in capture has sharp definition but with jaggies. Conclusion not all PS2 games are MDK2,Grandia 2 and other ports with bad textures