Can Sega-16 Beat the Last of the Genesis, Sega CD, & 32X Libraries in 2021?

[RvR]

So for make my video, I got to a challenge where the clues were perfectly clear, and put a few hours into only that challenge trying different ways of doing it that would give me the good ending. I checked manual and it didnt have much help, I tried doing more effects, less effects, etc. There seems to be no rhyme or reason for when it gives me the bad ending or the neutral ending. So quite simply you have to get lucky for at least some challenges. Maybe its just because I dont understand their slang? Like when he says it was good but not quite the pon-ix that means good but not great right? I actually messaged Kris Kross on Twitter asking if he knew how to do it lol I also messaged the founder of the development studio. The lead programmer was actually really engaging with the community and used to hang out on a dreamcast forum answering questions about his games, but sadly he passed away in 2016. To know exactly what criteria the challenges need for a win one will probably have to go into the code, and I have no idea how to do that. So I am giving up on this one. I wonder if the Marky Mark one was this bad? Props to whoever finished it.

Edit: I went and checked the Marky Mark clear and Chimaera said there were 5 challenges and posted screen shots of his name as the high score and the credits, so I am guessing he finished one of them because thats all you need for credits. In the Kris Kross game at least you dont even need to beat a challenge, all you have to do is make an attempt and it will give you the credits and high score table and any video with neutral feedback will score higher than the default top 10 in the game. In my game all 10 spots are names I put in myself, but Im not really sure if that would be considered a win. I did actually get the good result/feedback on one of the challenges so I guess you could consider that a clear, but the problem is there is a youtube video of the Marky Mark one and it shows that if you clear all the challenges there is actually an ending of sorts, some video footage you dont see otherwise(edit: I was wrong about this, its actually just game over footage). So, kinda a grey area, but at the very least I would say the game is not properly documented because I still have no idea what exactly gives you the good result/feedback.

[goldenband]

I actually messaged Kris Kross on Twitter asking if he knew how to do it lol

OK, that may be the greatest thing I've ever read on this thread. Awesome.

So, kinda a grey area, but at the very least I would say the game is not properly documented because I still have no idea what exactly gives you the good result/feedback.

All this is very interesting indeed, and exactly the kind of thing no one seems to know the answer to, short of YouTube videos that show what's possible without explaining how. All I can say is, keep at it and know that your efforts are appreciated! Thankfully the Sega CD library is finite and with every one of these mysteries solved, the overall picture gets clearer...

[RvR]

Update: I was able to find video of someone completing one of the challenges, so I copied exactly what they did and it gave me the bad result. I tried it again, bad result again. Tried it a third time and it gave me the good result. What I think is going on here is that for each win criteria its exactly 1 frame and if you are off by the smallest margin its simply a loss. This required zero effects or anything not mentioned in the criteria. I think if you dont change screens 6 or so times it auto rejects you but besides that it doesnt require anything extra. I tried updating my tactics based on this and was able to knock down a third challenge in only an hour or so. So thats 3/8. On the scoreboard at least it is automatically saving everything I do, but just in case this doesnt apply to the actual challenge completions I have been making a save state after each win. That way if I do get thru all 8 we will know for sure if there is actually an ending or not.

[RvR]

Ive been grinding hours into the MMV-KK all week. Monday-Tuesday I got 4 more challenges down. Im on the last one and its by far the most demanding. I've been playing it all day and Im at the point where it seems like Im getting the criteria but I did at least 5 perfect runs and only got neutral each time so Im missing something. The only thing I can think of is to make some ninja edits even more ninja. Basically there is a required frame and a forbidden frame right next to each other in 2 spots and Im guessing Im just missing the middle on one or both.

[RvR]

Update on the MMV stuff: I still cant beat the 8th and final challenge. I've been watching some footage of the other games though and it seems like the format for Kris Kross is different from the format for Marky Mark and INXS, which seem to be identical in format. If you watch that marky mark playthru on youtube, the player only gets the good result on one of the challenges and gets average or bad for the rest. I tried playing it myself and you do have to meet some criteria to advance thru the 5 levels, then credits and you enter your name. With Kris Kross its more like the challenges exist in isolation because you can choose to play any of them any time and each gives you the name entry and credits, and this doesnt depend on doing well. Also the "ending" of the marky mark one is actually the game over screen, because you will get it immediately if you fail badly enough. So does this mean you were never intended to "complete" these games the way Im trying to? Probably but I cant be entirely sure because maybe there actually would be an ending if you get all good results. I think I will look into some tool assists to see if I can find a way to do this last challenge and see if theres an ending.

[RvR]

My brothers, I have solved the riddle of the sphinx! I was unable to complete the Charise challenge, that shit should be considered a Battletoads level gaming feat because it defied me grinding hours into it for 3 weeks. However, I found a work around. You see everything I was finding about the MMV games suggested that 100% good ending them wouldnt reveal any secret ending, but I needed to prove it. So I started looking more and more into the other games. I played a lot of the Marky Mark one, I played a bit of the INXS one but it would sometimes crash Gens, and Power Factory had always crashed Gens on launch. I decided to first try an updated version of Gens made for TAS runners that had a build in speed adjuster and for a few hours yesterday played the Charise challenge in various levels of slow motion trying to get it right. No dice though, because for a speed to be low enough it ruins the games ability to correctly read the input, so what I would have to do is crazy mash the input at the right time, one after another, but too much would ruin it because you can move too far in one direction with the cursor. With this idea shot down I knew the path of least resistance was likely to turn to the other games, but the problem was the crashing. So I switched over to Kega, which is more functional than Gens despite me liking the Gens interface more. Power Factory worked like a charm and to my surprise it only has 3 challenges in it. I checked the internet and there was one guy who was able to get the neutral result on all 3 but seemingly nobody had ever gotten any of the good results. I started playing it 9 hours ago and basically just applied the method I developed from the Kris Kross game and it worked like a charm. The first 2 were like the easiest Kris Kross challenges, the third one I got after only a few tries, and the first try where it asks you for certain criteria. For each win screen a lady who I think is named Marina basically hits on you telling you youre awesome. The first challenge you are in a studio and its semi-formal, the other two its night time and she invites you into her limo to reward you for the hard work, the wording is slightly different for 2 and 3 but basically the message is the same. The hardest challenge was the 2nd, the "Hmm" song, and how I beat it was I waited for when he asks you to make the video "nicely cut" and gives you 5 frames to include. As soon as you get this and you get frames you recognize the challenge is yours for the taking. There was no special ending for doing all 3, simply the same credits and top 10 you get for getting a neutral result on any challenge:



Another bizarre quirk about the game is that when I was getting the neutral result it was giving me higher scores than my good ending wins.

Anyways, now that we have the knowledge that getting 100% good ending on everything doesnt do anything special, we can set a much more reasonable criteria for the other games. In my opinion it would be more than enough to get a good ending on 1 challenge and neutral on all others. With that in mind the Kris Kross game is done too, and whoever ends up doing the INXS game will hopefully read this post and not have to deal with a fraction of the BS I had to endure over the past few weeks lol

[goldenband]

You are a prince, RvR! This is why we have this thread -- to answer the questions humanity trembles to ask -- to find out, at long last, how to make Their Video. Well done!

[Raistlin]

Goldenband is absolutely right. It was so exciting to follow your run through these games RvR. You provided hints I am sure they are nowhere else to be found. I said it before I say it again: I love this thread and the reasons are all these stories and hints for games nobody ever played. I couldn't care less seeing youtubers playing Sonic games over and over again but reading how you've beaten a game like Make my video is when my Sega heart increases its beat.

[RvR]

Thank guys! A final note on MMV, I found the actor who played the host in the Kris Kross game on instagram and asked him if he knows what the slang "down with the po-nix" means and he doesnt lol He thinks it was supposed to be phonix, not sure if he meant phonics or phoenix. But anyways its nice to know the slang was as opaque to the actors as it is to me. Also Golden big props on beating Stellar Fire on easy mode, I tried easy mode and got stuck on the bat boss halfway thru the game. They really made that game devoid of any fun lol

Im taking a bit of a break from bad games to play some awesome ones now, I've been playing Popful Mail and its great, almost to the point where I want to recommend it to my friends who play modern games, though I doubt they can stomach the not-so-easy difficulty. After a while though I will be back, I still have to take a serious crack at T-Mek, hopefully get it done this year.

[the wizard 666]

So I beat Romance of the Three Kingdoms II over on VGS, and received the suggestion to cross-post my completion here, so here I am. Maybe this'll trigger a bit of activity, since the thread seems to have died.

[goldenband]

Awesome! Great to see some movement, and particularly nice to see a Koei game fall. Very much appreciated, and that brings us to 24 North American Genesis games left.

[Barone]

Normal Playthrough:


Hard Playthrough:



And, just like that, we discover that the Hard difficulty has some different segments in its path, aside from some enemies taking a bit more hits to die and projectiles flying a bit faster.
Unless I'm very mistaken, this information is nowhere else in the Internet and most of those different Hard segments/paths/angles are exclusive to the Sega CD version.

I'll write a full rundown of this game and port comparison tomorrow.

A whole new review with all the information and versions comparison I managed to gather (and then some) is now available here:
https://www.sega-16.com/2021/08/starblade/

[Chimaera]

After many hours, I finally beat PTO! It was a hard-fought victory for the Allies, but I took all the bases in the Pacific and learned a lot in the process. Working on a review for the site now.

Screenshot (3).jpg Screenshot (4).jpg Screenshot (6).jpg

[Goati]

I've beaten Tecmo Super NBA Basketball on Twitch and, uh... the game is very bad! Good music, though.

I tried to make it work as the Orlando Magics initially (because Shaq), but I absolutely couldn't.
So, after some hours, I restarted as the Chicago Bulls, and only started simulating games in the season once I was in a good spot to qualify for the playoffs and it was obvious that I was going to make it at that pace. That's how I approach these long-winded season modes.

Eventually I got into the playoffs and, simulating once or twice, the game actually simulated more than 1 game at once and I almost risked it all as that put me in the worst spot possible, where if I had lost I would've had to restart the season from scratch again... Because the game autosaves and has no save/load feature. So there was one such clutch occasion where I won by 1 point.

On a related note, selecting the preseason option, and I mean even just pressing C on "Preseason" on the main menu by accident, will absolutely wipe your entire season savefile. lol.

Here's a link to the last stream of it.
It was played on default settings, although putting the game speed to "fast" seemed ultrajanky as it only increases the running speed, and not the pass/shoot/anything-else-speed really. I also did not change team mid-season, so the only way this could get more "legit" is if you played all 90+ games manually.

Cheers

[goldenband]

Two victory posts in one day?! Amazing! Great work, Chimaera and Goati. Goati's journey through the playoffs was one of the more harrowing gameplay feats I've ever seen -- like watching a real basketball game. Clutch indeed.

22 North American Genesis releases left!