50Hz or 60Hz, finding the correct speed for Master System games

[FSR]

With Genesis/Mega Drive it's generally a good approximation to go with the NTSC version for the correct speed, just some exceptions exists here and there (Truxton plays closer to Arcade version on 50Hz, western version of Shadow of the Beast runs too fast in 60Hz, same with Soldiers of Fortune...)

How does one determine that for Master System games?

For international releases, I guess I could look at the NTSC version.
For the GG/SMS dual releases, the GG version can serve as a reference point.
Some games have an ingame timer, which can be compare to realtime.

What about PAL exclusive games that don't have a timer?
Any other ideas, suggestions etc.?

[Jessie]

I think most people agree 60Hz is better for most games. There are a few that are quirky (Can't recall which at the moment).

[Ryoandr]

I know for sure that Fire & Forget II is too fast in 60hz.

[Zz Badnusty]

Power Strike II plays fast as fuck on a North American Master System.

[goldenband]

western version of Altered Beast runs too fast in 60Hz

Took me a long moment to parse that -- "How could that possibly be true?" -- before I realized you meant Shadow of the Beast.

I think comparing the Game Gear version is a good idea, and I think you can also judge to some extent based on the location of the developer. But in some cases I have no idea how you're supposed to be 100% sure, especially if a game originated in a 60Hz region but only came out in a 50Hz region, or vice versa. For example, Air Rescue: what was the intended Hz of that one?

[Pixelepsy]

This is a good question, one I wish I had a solid answer for. There are some PAL exclusives for the master system that I want and I know some of them run fast with an NTSC. Others I'm not sure about, in particular Bubble Bobble. I plan to buy it soon regardless, but I may need to see about installing a 50-60 hz switch.

One way I do some investigation is to look on youtube videos and see if during the gameplay the filmer states what region master system they're using.

[KillerBean2]

Bubble Bobble is optimized for 50Hz, and so is The NewZealand Story. They both become rather glitchy when played in 60Hz

[FSR]

Thanks for the input so far, maybe we can assemble a list over time,

Altered Beast: matches better in both sound and gameplay when using 60Hz
Alex Kidd - The Lost Stars: 60Hz
Alien Storm - 60Hz
Asterix - timer matches better in 50hz but everything feels better at 60hz
Cyber Shinobi - timer too slow in 50hz (60 real seconds, 50 game seconds), so a 60Hz game
Danan the Jungle Fighter - can't decide, but then again at 60hz everything seems too fast for a muscle dude game
Streets of Rage - 60Hz (music and gameplay speed match 16bit version better)
Xenon2 - 50Hz (like anyone has been waiting for this)

[goldenband]

To follow up on my own question, I'm going to speculate that Air Rescue was meant for 60Hz. Japanese programmers, port of a System 32 game (as opposed to e.g. a Euro-centric licensed property), released in Brazil and Korea as well as Europe, and it plays perfectly at 60Hz.

[goldenband]

If you want to do this in roughly alphabetical order, here's another interesting one: 4 Pak All Action.

Developed in South Korea (a 60Hz market), localized for Australia (50Hz), but the individual games were (all?) released in SK. IIRC the Toto World/Cave Dude game wasn't optimized for 50Hz, though a couple bugs in the music were fixed in at least one game. I'm guessing 60Hz should be the "right" speed.

[Black_Tiger]

Games made with the Game Gear market in mind were likely developed around 60Hz.

The Mark III got Final Bubble Bobble, so if the PAL versions run imperfect in NTSC, then one version was likely optimzed for the other region. If this is true, then we shouldn't assume that the roms for games across PAL/NTSC reagons are all the same.

[NeoZeedeater]

I never had issues with PAL Bubble Bobble on my NTSC system. I just quickly compared it side by side with Final Bubble Bobble running through an emulator set to 60 hz and it seems identical to me.

[Pixelepsy]

I never had issues with PAL Bubble Bobble on my NTSC system. I just quickly compared it side by side with Final Bubble Bobble running through an emulator set to 60 hz and it seems identical to me.

Thanks for this info. Maybe people with larger SMS collections can contribute to this and hopefully make a list of games and their optimizations (or lack there of).

[NeoZeedeater]

Alien 3 has some garbled graphics sometimes when going through tunnel areas on NTSC but it's not annoying enough to harm the gameplay. The Game Gear version doesn't have that issue, on my copy anyway.

[KillerBean2]

I never had issues with PAL Bubble Bobble on my NTSC system. I just quickly compared it side by side with Final Bubble Bobble running through an emulator set to 60 hz and it seems identical to me.

Hmm, I guess my memory is playing tricks on me