Sweet Shooter Goodness...

[Black_Tiger]

Unfortunately, today more people seem to believe that popularizing something among the ignorant equals inventing, innovating, revolutionizing and anything/everything else of merit and everything else has to be less by default.






That comic seriously was made three years ago. This has become so prevalent that it's not hard now to call out upcoming revisionism in advance.

In the not-so-far-off future, video game history will equal "Nintendo" and "not-Nintendo". To a majority of "retro" game fans/collectors, it already does. Communities like this are the fringe.

[Barone]

Unfortunately, today more people seem to believe that popularizing something among the ignorant equals inventing, innovating, revolutionizing and anything/everything else of merit and everything else has to be less by default.

That comic seriously was made three years ago. This has become so prevalent that it's not hard now to call out upcoming revisionism in advance.

In the not-so-far-off future, video game history will equal "Nintendo" and "not-Nintendo". To a majority of "retro" game fans/collectors, it already does. Communities like this are the fringe.

I couldn't agree more. Rep given.

[QuickSciFi]

^And here I sat thinking I was the only one who compared Nintendo to Apple.

As much as I love gaming in general, it's always the same Nintendo fanboyism that draws the same hypster crowd that just has to buy that new iPhone every year. I'm not saying everyone who buys a MacBook is a blind follower who thinks computing "customizability" is the equivalent of "what shade of orange should I select as the cover of my laptop so it can best match the color of my beard." But, damn it, that's more than half of what I see out there. And it's the same blind fanboyism that trends in the Nintendo-centric crowd, I've noticed.

[Kamahl]

Unfortunately, today more people seem to believe that popularizing something among the ignorant equals inventing, innovating, revolutionizing and anything/everything else of merit and everything else has to be less by default.

The idea that aggressively advertising something is all it takes to make it popular is ridiculous. New coke and all that. As for the comic, Apple has been doing that for awhile, though that's not to say they haven't done some revolutionary things recently too (the force touchpad is the greatest thing ever put into a laptop since lithium ion batteries).

The iPad Pro is not revolutionary, it has no advantage what so ever vs existing competing products, nor will it be particularly successful (it'll get some nice sales just by virtue of being apple, it's a fashion brand after all, but will do nothing to stop the death spiral the iPad is in).

The Surface 3, the first one to not be absolute garbage, actually got some pretty sweet sales. Niche product is niche, and will remain so, so it won't get much better. It's funny but the surface would have triple the sales if they made it just a regular laptop, I'm serious. Adding a metaphorical cupholder to something doesn't really make it better .

[midnightrider]

How does the same person make a topic about appreciating underrated shoot 'em ups, and then turn it into blatant Nintendo fanboyism? There's no way there isn't some trolling happening at this point, but I'm still going to answer some points.

The debate can be made about which console rules. But the same could never be said about first party titles....just a random thought

Very random. Sega has great first party titles from the Master System to the Dreamcast: Alex Kidd, Shinobi, Streets of Rage, Golden Axe, Phantasy Star, Sonic(which seems grossly glossed over here, in spite of it's obviousness), their Disney games, Zaxxon, Pengo, Flicky, Hang-On, Outrun, Fantasy Zone, After Burner, Space Harrier, Alien Syndrome, Alien Storm, Columns, Virtua Racing, Virtua Fighter, Virtua Cop, Daytona, NiGHTS, Panzer Dragoon, Dynamite Deka(Die Hard Arcade/Dynamite Cop), Virtual-On, The House of the Dead, Jet Set/Grind Radio, Shenmue, the list goes on... Hell up until '92/'93 they themselves made every Capcom arcade port to their consoles, like Ghouls 'n Ghosts, Strider, Forgotten Worlds, Mercs, etc.

Anyone that's ever played it among the rest will concede that THE 8-bit RPG is Phantasy Star. Not Fire Emblem, not Mother, not one of the Final Fantasy's or Dragon Quest/Warrior's, but Sega's own Phantasy Star, for the Master System.

Right on about sega getting better with their in-house games. My point was more about SMS first party compared to NES 1st party. We got games like Hang-on & Nintendo got Zelda. Then during 16-bit era Nintendo publishes gems like Mario World 1 & 2, Metroid, LTTP, and I believe Earthbound would be considered in-house. All the games sega came up with in house for the genny just fail to compare to the epic-ness.

So, 4 incredible Sonic games, Ristar, early amazing ports of Capcom arcade games, Castle of Illusion, World of Illusion, Quackshot, Phantasy Star 4, 3 great Shinobi games, Sega's own arcade ports(Golden Axe, E-Swat, Columns, Outrun, Crack Down, Alien Storm, etc.), Golden Axe II, Monaco GP, Jewel Master, Bio-Hazard Batttle, and 3 of the best beat 'em ups ever in the Streets of Rage trilogy, (and I'm probably still forgetting something) can't compare to a handful of games? ...and you have the gall to call other people out on having a bias?

I love the Shinobi series and streets of rage 2, and PS 4; but its hard to back these as better games then Nintendo's.

Now this is a bias, but it's certainly not hard to back those as better than Nintendo's output for someone like me, who prefers arcade action to adventure games, but even find Phantasy Star 4 to be great. You might say Nintendo has this or that genre that Sega never dabbled in, but where are Nintendo's in house beat 'em ups, shoot 'em ups, and run 'n guns? On top of all the great titles I've already listed, Sega also has excellent arcade exclusive output to go along with it.

If you were to just boil down the libraries to first party only; Nintendo would put a beat down on poor little sega!! Comparing master system library to the nes in-house library makes it a miracle that sega thrived during the next gen. Ristar is very good, but I don't think its even close in gameplay and graphics to Yoshi's Island!!?? Even thou I freakin love the heck outta sega, it seems obvious that Nintendo had a lot more talent for game designers.

I don't think I have any more to add to that first bit, but as anyone with a functional brain can see, there's no beat down to be had. As for that last bit, and the fact that you kept bringing up Yoshi's Island, quite frankly, what Genesis owner would have wanted a children's coloring book looking game? This console's imagery was pretty much heavy metal: Barbarian outfits, skulls/skeletons, blood, flames, etc. Where in the midst of that would something like Yoshi's Island even begin to fit? There's a reason these consoles have the reputations they do, among the non-nerds that don't spend too much of their lives on the internet, anyway. I also see nothing Yoshi's Island does gameplay wise that outshines anything the Genesis has to offer in the platformer department either, Sega developed or not.

[QuickSciFi]

@OP: I distinctly remember back in 2008 or 9 going to Play N Trade. I found truxton (boxed, no manual), but in very good condition for $5. No one cared for Truxton then, or the Genesis, for that matter. It was a couple of years later that I got the manual for about $8. All it took for Truxton to get the hype was for the 2008 Classic Game Room HD review of the game to get noticed.

I wouldn't compare a vertical shmup to a horizontal shmup, though.

[EmperorIng]

Air Buster is a great game up until the gravity switch. Then it becomes a bad game, even with two players. Two players can watch as their lives melt away in an instant because what should have been a short, neat gimmick turns into a second-act ball-buster. This is a hunch/generalization of mine, but I think the more shooters you play, the less you like Gaiares. It stands out if you don't play a lot of better games.

What Genesis owner would have wanted a children's coloring book looking game?

Those who bought Rainbow Islands, New Zealand Story, or any of the Wonder Boy games, probably.

[midnightrider]

^so Japan, basically.

[tryphon]

^what does it mean ? Cute games are japan ? So Cool Spot, Mic and Mac, Aladdin are japan ?

No, so maybe you meant Japan makes only cute games ? So Final Fight, SoR, Shinobi, GnG mustn't be Japan ? Neither. I don't understand then.

I had a SMS, then a MD, and was Sega for a long time. And I like cute games. I consider Psychofox, Alex Kidd, Wonderboy 2, 3, 5, 6, Sonic, Shining Force, ... among the best I played, and they are cute.

To be honest, I find the whole thing "MD is for big dick guys and Nintendo for kiddies" one of the more stinking commercial bullshit I've ever heard. I hated those games that used their "adultness" to compensate for their bad gameplay (MK ?). Fortunately, here in Europa Sega didn't play this card too much.

[midnightrider]

That just simply meant that the games listed by EmperorIng never came to North America, except for Monster World III. Then from there, the only one that made it to Europe was Monster's Lair.

Admittedly I may have just been irritable yesterday, so don't take things personally miked, but understand that not everyone has to see things the same way you do, which I obviously, clearly don't.

[miked]

To midnightrider- I really dislike being labeled as a "Nintendo fanboy". I am a gamer; def not a collector. And, although I love both 16bit consoles, I am hardcore ride til die Sega loyalist. The main point behind the start off my thread was to get people's thoughts on 3 shooter's I love. I personally think Gaiares is a masterpiece of a game. Stealing weapons is an awesome mechanic, and the action on the scree along with the music is what makes me proud to kiss my genny at night. I probably had some contradicting statements because I really lovesome Nintendo 1st party stuff. I wasn't trying to troll, I was just attempting to fuel the debate fire.

I remember growing up and being the only kid I knew with a master system. So, I didn't have anyone to share my love of fantasy zone 2 with. And after playing games like mega man 2-4, castlevania 3, & super Mario bro's 3; I really became jealous of the NES. Even a simple game like punch-out is probably better then 95% of the American releases on the sms.

I am not one to take things personally, or one unable to see other points of view. I hope I don't come off that way. I do enjoy spirited debates about the games I grew up with If anyone out there is in need of a working genny, I would be more then happy to ship it to them for just the cost of shipping. Powercord, rf hookup (sorry), console and aftermarket 6 button for a nice model one...although if youre on this website shame one u if you don't already own a genesis console

[miked]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention I hate apple and all they stand for....to whoever brought up apple