Genesis Does: The Movie *must see*

[1magus]

That was pretty good and you made some very good points, a bit fanboy like at the beginning but still you went on the offensive to Nintendo and that makes me happy way too many people are Nintendo Fanboys!

[MN12BIRD]

Good points. I never thought of the connection between licensing out the 3DO hardware and the cost of the systems but it makes perfect sense now that I think about it. I still have to say the system itself was superb. The marketing and price of the thing wasn't but the system for the time was a step in the right direction. I don't mind the feel of the controller but I never thought about the number of buttons. It is less than SNES but only by one button. I'm guessing they didn't want it to look like a complete rip off of the SNES design but still wanted to use the L and R shoulder buttons. Its a cross between the Genesis 3 button and the SNES shoulder buttons.

I still think there is nothing wrong with Nintendo selling the Super Game Boy. I mean I wouldn't buy one but there is no point in complaining about it being an option! Its not a negative attribute to the SNES itself that it was made available. Some people might have liked the idea of playing the longer RPG style games like Final Fantasy and Zelda on a much easier to see TV screen. Sometimes the old brick GB screen is impossible to see clearly when you aren't in perfect lighting or outside in the sun. Like I said I didn't have nor would I have considered buying one myself.

As for the Wii I could care less. I liked the Game Cube as it was at least technically competitive with the generation it was in. The Wii is just an overclocked Cube with a fancy controller. I haven't checked out VC as I don't own a Wii but it sounds like a rip off if these games are selling for more than a few bucks. I'll give you the Wii and VC but I think the N64 and Cube where great systems.

Anyway its clear you like all forums of the old school VG scene. I actually watched your Yobo review on YouTube before and realized I had seen your videos before about half way into this one. I also noticed by mid into the 2nd part you weren't taking the SNES put downs %100 seriously and it was all in good fun by the end.

[17daysolderthannes]

I still think there is nothing wrong with Nintendo selling the Super Game Boy. I mean I wouldn't buy one but there is no point in complaining about it being an option! Its not a negative attribute to the SNES itself that it was made available. Some people might have liked the idea of playing the longer RPG style games like Final Fantasy and Zelda on a much easier to see TV screen. Sometimes the old brick GB screen is impossible to see clearly when you aren't in perfect lighting or outside in the sun. Like I said I didn't have nor would I have considered buying one myself.

I'll give you the Wii and VC but I think the N64 and Cube where great systems.

I'm not really complaining about, I think the only time you could complain about ANY product is if it was forced on you i.e. if Sega stopped making Genesis games and only made Sega CD games once the add on was released. Well, either that or you were mislead to believe something did something that it didn't or was of poorer quality than it should've been i.e. a new car that has lots of mechanical problems. I guess you could defend GB exclusives like Pokemon, but overall the whole point of GB was to be PORTABLE and the point of the Super NES was to be the real deal high end system. In other words, the GB was what you played when you couldn't be at home to play the Super NES, so why in god's name would you want to play GB games when you could be playing the far superior SNES games? To me, the Super GB almost feels like some kind of developer tool or something, and, come to think of it, that's probably where it came from, it was probably a development tool that they converted for home use. No matter how you slice it though, it was $50 that could've gone to a Super NES game, and I think even Gameboy Pocket was $50, so where's the real advantage there? Also, the fact that you needed to be in heavy lighting just further shows the flaws in the design of the Gameboy. IMO there just aren't nearly enough good original GB games to merit a $50 SNES adapter. Now, if Sega made a Game Gear adapter for the Genesis, that would be worthwhile, the Game Gear had some damn good exclusives.

As for N64 and Gamecube, like I said, I had an N64, but I was constantly disappointed when I compared it to the Playstation. Goldeneye was good, Perfect Dark was good, Super Mario 64 was good, LOZ:OOT was good (I don't like Zelda, but everyone else does), Wave Race, etc. etc. but just about everything besides Nintendo or Rare games sucked. Also, since the games were still on cartridges they would sometimes cost $80 (thats how much I paid for Shadows of the Empire IIRC, and it went player's choice a month later and sold for $40) whereas NEW Playstation games were $40 and Greatest Hits were $20. For $100 you could have a kickass library of PSX games: Gran Turismo, Final Fantasy VII, Metal Gear Solid, etc. etc. that could keep you busy for weeks. The reason I can't forgive the N64 is because it could've been like a primitive Dreamcast had it used CD's instead of the vastly inferior cartridges. Gamecube, on the other hand, I never really had any interest in, every (or almost every) great Gamecube game found its way to PS2 sooner or later, sometimes in an improved "special edition" form as well. There were only a handful of good Gamecube exclusives, and almost none of them interested me at all. I will forever and always proclaim the PS2 was the winner of the Dreamcast/Gamecube/XBOX generation, though I wish the Dreamcast would've stayed around longer, I still love playing that system.

[MN12BIRD]

The Super Game Boy was capable of displaying 16 colors or more for the game play if the games allowed for it. If any games actually programmed this added color feature in I don't know. Also some games actually had better sound and enhanced music when used on the SGB. I'm also pretty sure my buddy got his for free in a mail away deal for buying the SNES within a certain date. I could be wrong there but I seem to remember that. Still I see your point it defeats the purpose of the handheld.

I have always stood behind Nintendos choice of Cartridges for the N64 and feel that was what made it so special. I wouldn't call them "Vastly inferior" but they did cost much more to produce, pushed many 3rd party companies away and obviously couldn't hold as much data as a CD. RE2 was the largest N64 game made I believe it was 64MB (yes Bytes not bits) and contained all the FMV sequences as the PSX version along with higher resolution 3D (character) graphics.

My main problem is that so many people looked down upon the N64 for being cartridge based before it even got a chance. Most of them thinking a CD-ROM automatically has better graphics even tho they are both just storage mediums and have nothing to do with the graphical power. There is no reason for this other than the fact N64 carts specifically held only a fraction of the info possible on a CD. But really take out the redbook audio and FMV sequences and how many PSX games used over 64MB for the actual game, graphics/textures and sounds? I bet half of them didn't! Most PSX games could have been done on the N64 with better graphics (but minus FMV for the most part) IF it was needed but overhead cost of producing the carts pushed most 3rd party publishers away. I assume its less profit for them if they have to sell the games at the same price as PSX games?? That or like you said they would have to raise the price of the games and sell less because of it. Price is the main issue here. If it cost the same to built these 64MB carts as a CD (obviously I'm in backwards land) but IF it did more developers could have PUSHED the N64s abilities. Look at what RARE and Factor5 could do with that thing! Check out Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine or even Star Wars Rouge Squadron in high res mode with the RAM expansion. It was far superior graphically to anything I can remember on the PSX. The N64 could have been the "Arcade" king. FPS, Racing etc while the PSX would be better at RPG, Adventure games with longer vocalized stories where the FMV would aid the story of the game.

I know I'm starting shit here but the N64 should go down in history as the last cartridge based system and the end of an era! It was just massively underrated and never got the chance it deserved IMHO.

That said I owned a PSX in the day and NOT an N64! I was the guy laughing at anyone who bought an N64 actually. I really was a CD-ROM head, I loved the FMV, I loved the "high tech" feeling of ditching the ancient cartridges! I tried for weeks to talk my buddy out of buying an N64 and to instead go with the PSX!

Yes the PSX was the king of that era and YES the time was right for CD-ROM and the storage it provided. PSX won the war no questions asked and it had the games! I just don't feel that was the systems fault as much as the consumers and industry in general. Forget about the PSX for a minute and just look at the N64 for what it is. There is no reason other than cost that more great games didn't come out for it! I just can't blame "Money" when looking at a piece of hardware, looking at the system alone for what it is and nothing else.

It's just in looking back sometimes you see the potential something else had. Just because the N64 was limited in the data storage department doesn't mean it should have automatically flopped. It had the power to make up for it in other ways. First Analog controls, First vibration feedback, First "modern" machine to offer 4 players out of the box, and it had the graphical power if harnessed.

For anyone who hasn't seen Rouge Squadren in high res mode check out my YouTube video. It shows off what the N64 was capable of in the right hands.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbM4PYa-q8g

The only drawback visually is the low draw distance but this problem was fixed in Battle for Nabo, based on the same engine with similar graphics with a better draw distance.

[AD2101]

As much as Terminator and anything Terminator kicks ass, the movie could live without it. The star wars intro afterwards seemed like a better way to start everything off as it provides a little more history.

Other than that I thought it was a good counter to AVGN. Its hard to do a video like this from either angle without coming off as really biased or really bitter but I think you pulled it off. I especially liked the part when you went off on the Wii though that was good, I hate that thing and most of the people that buy it.

Its a shame that so many people are deeply entrenched in Nintendo, especially when those loyal fans get thanked with something as lame as the Wii. Hopefully this video will get some people to look at the other side and realize where the best of the best was at.

[17daysolderthannes]

As much as Terminator and anything Terminator kicks ass, the movie could live without it. The star wars intro afterwards seemed like a better way to start everything off as it provides a little more history.

Well, see, originally it was supposed to be one or the other as the intro, but as the director of the Lord of the Rings had like 15 endings for Return of the King (exaggeration but you get the idea), I just couldn't trash either one. I know the Terminator intro is kinda slow, but I didn't want to just jump in, I wanted a build up to maintain the "epic" feel of it and also (and this was a long way to go for it) because of the joke someone made one time when people were talking about modders using blue LEDs and one person said something to the effect of "When I have my system on, I want that red terminator eye staring back at me" and I just had to put that joke in my video, even if almost no one ever gets it, especially since the Sega Genesis was like the Terminator going after Nintendo. If you notice also (and its really hard to spot in the youtube resolution) I have the Sega CD case for Terminator right next to the system and Robocop vs. Terminator in the cartridge slot of the 32X. And again, like I said before, I wanted to have the old Sega ads as a segway into the video, like a time travel sequence almost. Maybe I should've done some kind of Back to the Future joke with it instead and incorporated the terminator joke somewhere else. In the full resolution you can really see the games and headlines in the ads and you can follow the evolution of the add ons from late 94 through early 96 and see all the games that never saw release.

[17daysolderthannes]

look a few posts up and read...

I looked it up again on Wikipedia, and, you're right, technically it was supposed to be capable of using 16 colors, but MOST games only used 4 colors in the main area of the screen and IMO it was always a gross and unnatural look no matter which colors you chose. I would always see the screen grabs from the Super Gameboy in gamepro as a kid and just go "blech, thats ugly!"

And as for the N64, I actually had (still have) Rogue Squadron, and, again, you have a pretty good point, it does look pretty good with the hi-res graphics. One thing I read recently is that the RAM designated for textures was incredibly small, so not only were the cartridges limited, but even with a 700MB cartridge it still would've had blurry textures unless they utilized some really tricky methods to make it look any better. The N64 wasn't all bad, but to me, the Playstation one games just hold up better with time. Gran Turismo still looks and plays awesome in my book, and Final Fantasy VII is still one of the most fanboyed RPGs ever. The only thing the PS1 lacked was a decent smoother to get rid of jaggies and a less than stellar total polygon count. More than anything I just hated the cost of N64 games. I think at launch the N64's games were the most expensive games ever made spare for some Super FX games and the Genesis version of Virtua Racing. You really just kind of reiterated my points in a different way, the N64 COULD HAVE been great if they would've not been so stubborn and used cartridges, but with all the limitations it dragged the system down. I think the Sega CD suffered 10X the neglect from developers that the N64 did. If the Sega CD really had the development it deserved, we could have seen some amazing things done. One game that really surprised me was Formula 1 - beyond the limit. It's almost like an early playstation racing game. If they would've taken it farther, there could've been an outstanding precursor to Gran Turismo or Need for Speed.

[MN12BIRD]

Yeah I didn't even know the SCD had extra scaling hardware in it until just recently when I saw some videos on YouTube and picked up Batman Returns.

Before then I only thought the thing was storage and of course the redbook audio but as far as processing power and graphical power I didn't know it added anything to the table. Its funny now to look back knowing it had that potential that was rarely used. I would have loved more racing games and even an FPS like perhaps Wolf3D! I think it could have been done decently well on the SCD in the right hands!

The N64 does have texture memory size limitations but once again I think Factor5 and Rare had some programming tricks up their sleeves to get around them. Indiana Jones and the Infernal machine had some impressive (for the N64) textures in it. I think Goldeneye (doesn't even use the extra RAM) still stands up quite well today.

Like the SCD not enough developers pushed it. I guess luckily for the SCD the FMV games actually sold at the time. They seemed so impressive at the time but grew old fast! But given the limited number of SCD systems out there at the time I guess thats part of the reason too.

[17daysolderthannes]

Its a shame that so many people are deeply entrenched in Nintendo, especially when those loyal fans get thanked with something as lame as the Wii. Hopefully this video will get some people to look at the other side and realize where the best of the best was at.

(god, I'm terrible at neglecting to combine posts)

Worst of all, Nintendo doesn't even seem to care about its loyal fans anymore, every commercial is marketing to Grandma or Mr. and Mrs. Yuppie (Wii Fit anyone?). They've completely forgotten about who got them there, but unfortunately the Wii and DS are catching on so well with the previously non-game playing crowd that they won't even miss the lost sales. To be honest, of all the console makers out there, I think Sega was the only one that genuinely tried to give their fans what they wanted, even if their fans couldn't afford to buy it all. When CD systems started appearing, the Sega CD came out. When 32-bit systems were on the horizon, the 32X came out. When the technology allowed for it, the Sega Nomad made it possible for Genesis on the go. I think even Sega knew that some of these systems would just barely turn a profit, yet they still made them because they knew their fans wanted them. There is no product I feel Sega released with the intention of suckering people out of their money, except maybe the Activator, that was pretty damn retarded. I bet tons of people were super pissed that the Super Nintendo CD never came out or that the Famicom Disk System never had an American release. Say what you will but I think Sega tried to give their fans what they wanted more than any other console maker ever did, almost to the point of being wreckless about it. They took the chance by putting the blood in Mortal Kombat because they knew people wanted it, they made Streets of Rage because everyone hated the mediocre SNES port of Final Fight. And, lest we forget, Genesis always had and will always have the BEST controllers EVER. The Sega 6 button arcade stick feels like playing at the arcade. I've never used a Neo Geo stick before, but I bet its almost as good if not better. Honestly, I wish Nintendo was the one that would've dropped out of the hardware market and just sold its first party titles for all systems because, after all, most people just buy the Nintendo systems for the exclusives anyway. Even though stats say otherwise, I still think the Dreamcast was a better system than the Gamecube, especially once you consider it came out 2 years before.

[Earthworm_Jim_Fan]

the Super Gameboy didn't let you play with 2 players, so it actually was even more pointless than buying a second gameboy, .

Wrong. The Super Game Boy, indeed let you play two players on certain games, like Wario Blast.

[sonicwatcher6969]

Sega 16 defiantly needs a user's video page in the media section, Joe Redifer's 'Advanced Technology and You video' is awesome! All hands in favour: say I

[TmEE]

This is some really good stuff !!! You should have used some other music in SW style intro part...

Some incorrections : MD and MCD have a 68000 not a 6800 which is Motorola's 8-bit CPU of the 68xx family. Also, don't forget the Z80 in MD.

[Zebbe]

He wrote about the 68k mistake in the video info to the right.

[TmEE]

but no Z80...

[Phantar]

Well, see, originally it was supposed to be one or the other as the intro, but as the director of the Lord of the Rings had like 15 endings for Return of the King (exaggeration but you get the idea), I just couldn't trash either one. I know the Terminator intro is kinda slow, but I didn't want to just jump in, I wanted a build up to maintain the "epic" feel of it and also (and this was a long way to go for it) because of the joke someone made one time when people were talking about modders using blue LEDs and one person said something to the effect of "When I have my system on, I want that red terminator eye staring back at me" and I just had to put that joke in my video, even if almost no one ever gets it, especially since the Sega Genesis was like the Terminator going after Nintendo. If you notice also (and its really hard to spot in the youtube resolution) I have the Sega CD case for Terminator right next to the system and Robocop vs. Terminator in the cartridge slot of the 32X. And again, like I said before, I wanted to have the old Sega ads as a segway into the video, like a time travel sequence almost. Maybe I should've done some kind of Back to the Future joke with it instead and incorporated the terminator joke somewhere else. In the full resolution you can really see the games and headlines in the ads and you can follow the evolution of the add ons from late 94 through early 96 and see all the games that never saw release.

yeah, but like I said before, if you want to build up atmosphere and suspense, the T2-like intro doesn´t really work...

I mean, having several endings isn´t that bad, since the viewer already is viewing the video for a while, is already drawn into the suspense, and most of the relevant info has already been passed on.

While with several intros, if you don´t manage to catch the viewers attention at once, he will switch off and is not likely to receive any info or entertainment at all!

I can understand that you didn´t want to drop the idea (and it´s a good one), but the StarWars-like (second) intro is by far more powerful IMO in order to catch attention - and if you put a two-minute text-only intro in front of that, many people will get bored before even seeing the better parts!

If you don´t want to drop the T2-intro, find a way to work it somewhere in between. For example, you´ve already split the video in three parts - why not put it at the end of part 1, for example? I feel it would be more suited there...