Sega-16 Politics Thread

[retrospiel]

I can make words stink like dog poo

You're the human equivalent of a headless chicken.

[TheEdge]

What's that? A condescending and sarcastic delusional characterture involving Al-Qaeda? When the topic at hand was dealing with the Taliban government?

Your right. My bad.

He was pointing out the obvious. That it is entirely possible and likely for 'someone' to forsake the nations security from within or aid in the process, with the hopes of bettering their own stature with foreign nations.

Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. THE TALIBAN want to make our women wear robes while stealing our freedom.

We need to attack the THE TALIBAN's at all cost. There is an international Jihadist Organization in the heart of the Iran. We need to send someone in there. No we don't have proof. No, We have no information to prove it is a real threat but we can't go on "Proof" , we can't go on "Reality" , We need to save the babies and the doggies and the women because if we don't the dreaded extremist evil-doers will take away our cars, video games, apple pie, and freedom.

AND BASEBALL......THE TALIBAN's hate baseball.

[GriskaGyoran]

The Taliban itself does not pose any sort of threat, however since they are in cahoots with Al-Quaeda they make themselves related to a threat. So as for the war in Afghanistan, there is no need for direct conflict only the seizing of the ringleaders of international rings. Afghanistan is rather a position we need to destroy Al-Quaeda, but not the government. If we do so we end up with another Iraq, a mess that we have to clean up, and that would lead to a position similar to that of the Soviet Afghan war. If we continue to fight in these places then we risk over-blowing our military and leading to massive federal debt, which we see the early signs of already.

[TheEdge]

There is no Al-Qaeda........

We created them.....we still fund them......

There is no threat.....no one is in "cahoots" with anyone.......

We went there for .... No bid military contracts, the Gas Pipline, and the (Poppi)Heroine........

It's all a lie. A lot of people are dead for nothing.

[retrospiel]

There is no Al-Qaeda........

We created them.....

Don't you think that this contradicts itself ?

[TheEdge]

Don't you think that this contradicts itself ?

Al-Qaeda doesn't exist in the sense that it's a bunch of shadowy Muslims who hate apple pie, freedom, and baseball.

If someone said US / British Funded Al-Qaeda I would have to agree with them. Meaning some random 3rd world groups they equipped with rusty weapons and told to go cause havoc on our front lines or in whatever nation they want to attack next.

[TheEdge]

Obama approved 13,000 more troops to Afghanistan

In an unannounced move, President Barack Obama is dispatching an additional 13,000 US troops to Afghanistan beyond the 21,000 he announced publicly in March, The Washington Post reported Monday.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20091013...militarytroops

OBAMA THE WARMONGER!!!! YES WE CAN DIE FOR NOTHING!!!

[Knuckle Duster]

OBAMA THE WARMONGER!!!! YES WE CAN DIE FOR NOTHING!!!

ZOMG MOAR TROOPZ MEANS BIG LETTERZ URGENCY NECESSARY!!!

This thread needs to be renamed to:
"Crackpot Bookmark Dump"

[GriskaGyoran]

The Al-Quaeda=creation by CIA is entirely possible.

Back in the Soviet Afghan war Bin Laden was a major buyer of US war material. However we know they were not rich enough to actually purchase this stuff. So there is the possibility that Bin Laden and the former Mujahideen owe the US some favors. It is entirely possible that Al-Quaeda is an agent of the US in order to get approval by other countries to set up sites to "protect" weaker nations/ take them over. But then again this is only possibility. I am not trying to say that THIS SI TEH TROOTH. But putting it out there as a possible scenario.

As for troop deployment, to be honest I think that this is one of the most foolish moves I have seen in military history, this and the landing at Galipoli. We are facing another Iraq sitsuation and I dont think the economy can handle it. Tax rates will go through the roof and I do say I am glad I have another home to fall back on just in case this one becomes too much of a hassal.

[Metal_Sonic]

The Al-Quaeda=creation by CIA is entirely possible.

Back in the Soviet Afghan war Bin Laden was a major buyer of US war material. However we know they were not rich enough to actually purchase this stuff. So there is the possibility that Bin Laden and the former Mujahideen owe the US some favors. It is entirely possible that Al-Quaeda is an agent of the US in order to get approval by other countries to set up sites to "protect" weaker nations/ take them over. But then again this is only possibility. I am not trying to say that THIS SI TEH TROOTH. But putting it out there as a possible scenario.

The major flaw with that theory is that the U.S never created Al-Qaeda or even funded them. I'll let the evidence talk.

From a BBC documentary called "The Power of Nightmares":

It is often said that bin Ladin was funded by the CIA. This is not true, and indeed it would have been impossible given the structure of funding that General Zia ul-Haq, who had taken power in Pakistan in 1977, had set up. A condition of Zia's cooperation with the American plan to turn Afghanistan into the Soviet's 'Vietnam' was that all American funding to the Afghan resistance had to be channeled through the Pakistani government, which effectively meant the Afghan bureau of the Inter Services Intelligence (ISI), the military spy agency.

The American funding, which went exclusively to the Afghan mujahideen groups, not the Arab volunteers [bin Ladin's groups], was supplemented by Saudi government money and huge funds raised from mosques, non-governmental charitable institutions and private donors throughout the Islamic world. Most of the major Gulf-based charities operating today were founded at this time to raise money or channel government funds to the Afghans, civilians and fighters. In fact, as little as 25 per cent of the monet for the Afghan jihad was actually supplied directly by states.
Page 59, Al Qaeda: The true story of radical Islam
Jason Burke

Source: http://foi.missouri.edu/terrorintell...ghostwars.html

Wheaton, Md.: There have been accusations from the left that have directly accused the CIA of funding and training bin Laden. Is there any truth to this ?

Steve Coll: I did not discover any evidence of direct contact between CIA officers and bin Laden during the 1980s, when they were working more or less in common cause against the Soviets. CIA officials, including Tenet, have denied under oath that such contact took place. The CIA was certainly aware of bin Laden's activities, beginning in the mid- to late-1980s, and they generally looked favorably on what he was doing at that time. But bin Laden's direct contacts were with Saudi intelligence and to some extent Pakistani intelligence, not with the Americans.

There is more here:
http://www.911myths.com/html/bin_lad...o_the_cia.html

So basically, the U.S never created, funded, supplied, or even contacted Osama and his group. Now I know you weren't claiming your theory to be truth but it's wrong, no disrespect intended.

As for troop deployment, to be honest I think that this is one of the most foolish moves I have seen in military history, this and the landing at Galipoli. We are facing another Iraq sitsuation and I dont think the economy can handle it. Tax rates will go through the roof and I do say I am glad I have another home to fall back on just in case this one becomes too much of a hassal.

A major problem with our strategy in the Middle East is our ROE. Whenever there are civilians present on a battlefield, the army can't use airstrikes or artillery and they have to disengage, even if it means the enemy gets away.
More info here:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_fallen...FsbGVubWFyaW5l

[GriskaGyoran]

Ehh, but at the same time an official would say that just to keep the image of America out of funding terrorist groups. I mean the US/NATO did have a similar apprach to the Soviet opperation. USSR was "You hate NATO, heres a load of weapons... do whatever."

America was pretty much the same. Israel is a prime example. But I mean it wouldn't be good to trust BBC. I mean it is like selling a gun to a mass murderer, would you admit that you did it? Obviously if the government did it they would be the last to admit it. Once again not to sound like Dr. Conspiracy, but given the opposition to the USSR I think that there was either indirect weapon supply, training and whatnot. Remember, to the US, the USSR was basicaly the doomsday state and anything to stop them would have been done.

[ThugsRook]

......

kool aid anyone? Metal_Sonic is buying

[Kiba in Exile]

It's also just a coincidence that the two countries our leaders felt it necessary to invade border Iran on each side. You see, the terrorists responsible for the 9/11 attacks had to have come from Afghanistan, and possible weapons of mass destruction had to have been discovered in Iraq.

Good moves, if you were playing Risk.

[TheEdge]

Metal Sonic, I noticed that you keep referring to Osama bin laden like he is was some kind of "president" or "leader" of Al-Qaeda. This is not true. Osama bin Laden has nothing to do with anything. Bin Laden had nothing to do with 9/11, Al-Qaeda, or any other terrorist group. He was nothing more than a CIA contact. The Bush family actually met WITH the Bin Laden family the day before 9/11 and years before Osama got treatment at a Pakistani hospital and was met by CIA agents.

Furthermore, the word "Al-Qaeda" was created by the US and Britain to create a database for the mujahadeen fighters they were funding to attack Russia. After the Russian / Afghanistan war was over, so was their funding. It would be unsafe to believe that the US and British wouldn't start funding random terrorists to create the illusion of "Al-Qaeda" or "terror". There are a lot of young uneducated arab men who would love a briefcase full of money a month to attack american troops.

Ehh, but at the same time an official would say that just to keep the image of America out of funding terrorist groups. I mean the US/NATO did have a similar apprach to the Soviet opperation. USSR was "You hate NATO, heres a load of weapons... do whatever."

America was pretty much the same. Israel is a prime example. But I mean it wouldn't be good to trust BBC. I mean it is like selling a gun to a mass murderer, would you admit that you did it? Obviously if the government did it they would be the last to admit it. Once again not to sound like Dr. Conspiracy, but given the opposition to the USSR I think that there was either indirect weapon supply, training and whatnot. Remember, to the US, the USSR was basicaly the doomsday state and anything to stop them would have been done.

Yes, its well known that the super powers US, Britain, Russia, China or whatever fund smaller organizations to do their bidding and its just silly to believe that the US or its CIA agents would admit publically to anything. To be honest getting information from the US government is like getting information from the Oil and Tobacco companies. It's all fluff and useless. The best way to figure out how all of this is a fake charade is by just looking up articles and reading between the lines.

[TheEdge]

Recruited by MI5: the name's Mussolini. Benito Mussolini

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009...ited-mi5-italy

Hitler and Mussolini were funded by the British.