SegaCD = Greatest CD add on?

[tomaitheous]

Well if that's true, then why are you guys trying to say Turbo CD is better than Sega CD when they both sold about the same world wide.

I'm not entirely sure what you mean. I'm not saying they sold the same world wide. I'm saying NEC/Hudson sold more. And better is subjective. But if you would rate the number of CD titles quality(still subjective) and quantity wise instead of or in conjunction with, then the buck would still go to NEC's little addon.

I'm still trying to find out where people are pulling 10million world wide. The only source I can find is Gamepro actually siting this (2.5million for TG16 as of 1991 in the US and 10million world wide) and that's only for the non CD systems - i.e. excluding the 3 Duo systems. NEC dropped the card based systems after '91 - world wide.

And given the popularity of the Megadrive, I really don't see 2.5million being accurate. That's practically 1:1 (if not over that) to Japanese Megadrive base systems. I really do think someone's mixed up the EU and JP sales figures or are just plain incorrect. The two Lunar games weren't going to drastically push sales figures way up there from the already sagging sales from the start to some amazing number like that. I know Lunar is special in the eyes of a lot of SegaCD fans, but Japan was the land of thousands of RPGs. And with much, much, much more popular RPGs than Lunar at the time on all kinds of more popular systems. And I'm not sure what else (important software releases) is going to really contribute or back up those stated sales numbers.

[gamegenie]

Maybe TG-16/CD just sold more in you guy's mind.

I use to blindly think Genesis was number #1 in the 16-bit wars until now I see that Sega got it's clocked cleaned by SNES.


If Turbo CD really was such a big hit, it would be a name that still resonates today but as you can see from the lack of sale info on the system it's not even that popular except for few dedicated forums.

[Black_Tiger]

Maybe TG-16/CD just sold more in you guy's mind.

I use to blindly think Genesis was number #1 in the 16-bit wars until now I see that Sega got it's clocked cleaned by SNES.


If Turbo CD really was such a big hit, it would be a name that still resonates today but as you can see from the lack of sale info on the system it's not even that popular except for few dedicated forums.

Again, you're making up crazy notions (like a console that bombs has the best games) to support an answer that you picked from the beginning, just like your previous blind Genesis vs SNES perception.

Sales numbers or even online forums don't mean anything. You can't argue that the PC Engine wasn't successful, yet there isn't much of any solid sales data for it. There aren't many dedicated Genesis, NES or SNES forums. Sega-16 is the only one I know of.

If your disappointment of learning that technically, the SNES sold a few more units than the Genesis has you desperate to carve out a victory for the Sega-CD, so be it. Anyone familiar with the library of Sega/Mega-CD and PCE CD games knows that as many good - great games there are for Sega/Mega-CD, there are just that many more quality CD games for PCE. It doesn't take anything away from the Sega-CD.

If it makes you feel better, the stand alone Sega-CD is more powerful than the bare-bones stand alone PCE CD-ROM. If that makes it the best add-on for you then don't worry about it. I'd argue that since the Genesis cart library is so strong, not only did it deter people from bothering with the Sega-CD, it's not as proportionately impressive or an improvement for software as the PCE-CD is over HuCards.

Most people will base "best"-ness on the software, being that it determines the usefulness of an "add-on". Going by either the CD game library or the impact it has over a console's cart library, the PCE CD-ROM is "teh best!" overall.

[gamegenie]

Again, you're making up crazy notions (like a console that bombs has the best games) to support an answer that you picked from the beginning, just like your previous blind Genesis vs SNES perception.

Quote me where I made that notion?

I don't think consoles that bomb have the greatest games. If I were to believe that I would be rooting for Jaguar or TG-16.

[Black_Tiger]

Quote me where I made that notion?

I don't think consoles that bomb have the greatest games. If I were to believe that I would be rooting for Jaguar or TG-16.

Here ya go-

Originally Posted by Black_Tiger
hardware sales aren't the single indicator of success. What good is a 100 million consoles sold at a loss if you only sell 100 pieces of software total?

what that means to me is that a system's games were so great that 100 million people picked up the hardware to play it.

Again, if you believe that success means selling bricks instead of software, or that losing money is better than making money, then so be it, but sales in general aren't a measure of quality or value, only popularity.

Also the fmv games you love are what most people feel tarnish the Sega-CD.

[gamegenie]

Here ya go-



Again, if you believe that success means selling bricks instead of software, or that losing money is better than making money, then so be it, but sales in general aren't a measure of quality or value, only popularity.

Also the fmv games you love are what most people feel tarnish the Sega-CD.

no you provided a weak analogy. A 100 million consoles is good, no matter how you look at it.

There's something about those 100 pieces of software that 100 million went out and bought them. That's all I'm saying.

[Black_Tiger]

no you provided a weak analogy. A 100 million consoles is good, no matter how you look at it.

When each console is sold at a loss, it's not good nor a success.

There's something about those 100 pieces of software that 100 million went out and bought them. That's all I'm saying.

If only 100 pieces of software sold, it would mean that only 1 in every 1 million people bothered to buy a single game. The rest would be watching CD+Gs, dvds, blurays or some other non-game use.

[kool kitty89]

I think he thought 100 titles sold well on said console. I kind of see your point, but I think your hypothetical example is a bit weak.

[Black_Tiger]

I think he thought 100 titles sold well on said console. I kind of see your point, but I think your hypothetical example is a bit weak.

I shouldn't have had to go to such an extreme to try get across the idea that lots of people buying lots of games is a positive thing. gamegenie kept using unrelated figures to say that more Sega/Mega CD-ROMs were sold than PCE CD-ROM units, desperately trying to disprove your comment that the PCE CD-ROM was more successful. I really doubt that, but even if it's true I think it's safe to say that more PCE CD games were sold.

The ironic thing is, the idea of '100 titles selling per console' behind his "what that means to me is that a system's games were so great that 100 million people picked up the hardware to play it" comment is actually what I've been saying about the PC Engine. Lots of people bought lots of games for it because the system's games were so great. The attach rate for Sega/Mega-CDs had to be way lower, especially considering that the PCE CD-ROM was successful for a good 7 years straight.

[gamegenie]

I shouldn't have had to go to such an extreme to try get across the idea that lots of people buying lots of games is a positive thing. gamegenie kept using unrelated figures to say that more Sega/Mega CD-ROMs were sold than PCE CD-ROM units, desperately trying to disprove your comment that the PCE CD-ROM was more successful. I really doubt that, but even if it's true I think it's safe to say that more PCE CD games were sold.

The ironic thing is, the idea of '100 titles selling per console' behind his "what that means to me is that a system's games were so great that 100 million people picked up the hardware to play it" comment is actually what I've been saying about the PC Engine. Lots of people bought lots of games for it because the system's games were so great. The attach rate for Sega/Mega-CDs had to be way lower, especially considering that the PCE CD-ROM was successful for a good 7 years straight.

In the end it always come down to sales. I wasn't desperately trying to disprove it because it doesn't take much to see when you look at the figures that TG-16 and it's CD brother was less successful than Genesis and Sega CD, which were in turn less successful than Super Nintendo on a worldwide scale.

If it had been otherwise you see that reported.

[kool kitty89]

Gamegenie,

I think you're missing something, you're saying hardware sales are most important (which is debatible), but you seem to have missed the clarification that the PC-Engine CD sold better overall world wide (with the standalone Duo included) than the Sega CD.

I'm not saying they sold the same world wide. I'm saying NEC/Hudson sold more. And better is subjective. But if you would rate the number of CD titles quality(still subjective) and quantity wise instead of or in conjunction with, then the buck would still go to NEC's little addon.

I'm still trying to find out where people are pulling 10million world wide. The only source I can find is Gamepro actually siting this (2.5million for TG16 as of 1991 in the US and 10million world wide) and that's only for the non CD systems - i.e. excluding the 3 Duo systems. NEC dropped the card based systems after '91 - world wide.

However, one important note that I've already mentioned is that, of the new "advanced" late 4th gen early 5th gen consoles -some of which were completely niche- (most of wich were CD based), like the CD-i, 3DO, 3DO (though I wouldn't put the Neo CD in the same category), the Sega CD was the best selling of them in the western markets.
Granted a large portion of success was built on the short lived FMV craze, which unfortunately resulted in the sharp decline in interest in 1994.

[gamegenie]

^^

according to who? Until someone can show some actual numbers of TG-CD sales. I am going to assume it sold less than TG-16 which was only 10 million world wide.

CD technology no where near as popular as it was in the late 90s on both sides of the hemisphere.

[Black_Tiger]

I think what holds the Sega CD back from delivering a true arcade laser disc experience is the slow 1X CD read speed it has. A game I own that comes to mind is Who Shot Johnny Rock, it's port from the American Laser Games laserdisc games, and the slow loading speed is quite noticeable when you're shooting.

There actually is Genesis Laserdisc hardware and Mega LD games which deliver "a true arcade laserdisc experience", but it was a disaster because of the high price of the hardware ($1500) and the fact that fmv games are a pretty limited genre that aren't as entertaining for most people as most other games.

If it had been otherwise you see that reported.

There's still no reliable info for 16-bit console sales in general. We're just hoping that what limited info there is is some what accurate. Much of what's out there sales-wise and in general about "success" is reported by the media who also say that the SNES was and will always be awesome but the Genesis is clunky and super inferior, so you have to take it with a grain of salt.

Since you thought that the CD-I was more exposed than the TG-16/CD, it's safe to say that you didn't stay on top of game news back in the day. If you were familiar with how things went down back then as well as with the huge PC Engine library and hardware available, you'd realize just how well it really did.

[tomaitheous]

^^

according to who? Until someone can show some actual numbers of TG-CD sales. I am going to assume it sold less than TG-16 which was only 10 million world wide.

CD technology no where near as popular as it was in the late 90s on both sides of the hemisphere.

For one, stop using TG CD if you mean PCE CD (same goes for Duo and PCE Duo) or if you're responding to something specific to the japanese market. I don't know if you're doing it on purpose, but it's annoying/confusing. A lot of what kool kitty98, black_tiger, and I are referring to is the Japanese market. One site has PCE listed as 3.92mil with 1.92mil CD addon solds, but it doesn't have any numbers for the Duo and the later Duo-R/RX. Nor does it have any info on US sales numbers. It also listed MegaCD with a total sales of 400,000.

[gamegenie]

For one, stop using TG CD if you mean PCE CD (same goes for Duo and PCE Duo) or if you're responding to something specific to the japanese market. I don't know if you're doing it on purpose, but it's annoying/confusing. A lot of what kool kitty98, black_tiger, and I are referring to is the Japanese market. One site has PCE listed as 3.92mil with 1.92mil CD addon solds, but it doesn't have any numbers for the Duo and the later Duo-R/RX. Nor does it have any info on US sales numbers. It also listed MegaCD with a total sales of 400,000.

This site list 2.5Mil sold for TG-16
http://forum.pcvsconsole.com/viewthread.php?tid=14306