Built to last ?

[Diosoth]

Clone hardware should handle issues with old cartridge games... assuming the cartridges themselves hold up. Both the usual unlicensed stuff and whatever Sega licenses out.

Current consoles... well, PS2s and 360s already have a small but deserved rep for failures. They won't work in 20 years, but odds are any game will be on a new format anyway. Not that game companies want you playing old games, even if they can resell them cheap in modern ports. They want you to play and buy current games.

[Chris]

Thanks alot, I'd never heard of that before, just about the pin connectors. I've never actually seen an NES 2 in the wild, and I've only seen 2 SNES 2's
I also think I might have heard that the sound isn't as good on the top loader NES but I may be mistaken.

[kool kitty89]

The thing about the NES 2 is that it's only got RF output, so both the sound and video are poor, suposedly slightly worse than RF on the original nes too. (it can be moded to output composite video and proper audio though)
Those lucky Japanese got the AV Famicom instead, with the standard SNES/N64/GC a/v port... (granted the original Famicom only had RF)

This kind of thing is common for cost reduction though, the Sega Master System II only had RF as well.


Oh, and BTW disabling the lockout chip will also remove region lockout, so you can play PAL carts too.

[17daysolderthannes]

Current consoles... well, PS2s and 360s already have a small but deserved rep for failures.

No, PS2 does not deserve a rep for failures, well maintained consoles last forever (meaning you didn't kick the fucking thing around or let it get chock full of dust like many people do). The 360 on the other hand...almost every single 360 owner has had or will have RROD and/or a DVD drive failure. Even the NES doesn't compare to the epic fail of the 360.

[tomaitheous]

No, PS2 does not deserve a rep for failures

Bullshit. The PS2 is a piece of shit. The slim model finally fixed a lot of problems, but not after I went through two fat models. I didn't "kick" the system, expose the systems to excessive dust, box it onto a cab where it could over heat ,etc. Nor did I ever play DVD movies on the thing. DVD drive went out on both units. The last few months of each console sucked as I had to constantly adjust the laser height - trying to find that sweet spot. I'm not the only one. All of my friends with original PS2's had DVD drive death. We were adults, not kids and took care of our systems.

[17daysolderthannes]

Bullshit. The PS2 is a piece of shit. The slim model finally fixed a lot of problems, but not after I went through two fat models. I didn't "kick" the system, expose the systems to excessive dust, box it onto a cab where it could over heat ,etc. Nor did I ever play DVD movies on the thing. DVD drive went out on both units. The last few months of each console sucked as I had to constantly adjust the laser height - trying to find that sweet spot. I'm not the only one. All of my friends with original PS2's had DVD drive death. We were adults, not kids and took care of our systems.

Well mine is 7 1/2 years old and plays absolutely everything PERFECTLY. When I wasn't playing PS2 games, my sister was playing DVDs on it. You, sir, apparently don't know what you're doing. Your "height adjustment" is probably what ruined it. I'm not the only one with an ancient PS2 still kicking ass either. All the ones I see that don't work are chock full of dust and show obvious signs of being dropped and knocked around. PS2s don't deal well with physical abuse, but if left alone and not subjected to dust they last forever, mine is proof. If you were really a 1337 HaXOr you would've just replaced the laser and saved yourself $100+, but if you dicked with the height adjustment, it was probably too far gone anyway.

[tomaitheous]

Well mine is 7 1/2 years old and plays absolutely everything PERFECTLY.When I wasn't playing PS2 games, my sister was playing DVDs on it.

Where did I say every PS2 in the world has died? Come on, man. There will always be some systems that don't have any symptoms or still run. But they are *not* in the majority from my personal experience. Nor do they seem to be the case nation wide.

You, sir, apparently don't know what you're doing. Your "height adjustment" is probably what ruined it.

Oh really? Wow, you were there? Right beside me, in my house, the whole time knowing exactly what happened? Fool. Do you what the height adjustment is or how it works? Aren't you "Mr. Console-fix-it-man" by job title? It's a notched spiral/ramp mechanism. Going to far, just drops it back down to the lowest level. One, I marked the original setting and two since it was a notched/lock knob, it's not like you have infinite fine adjustment. Two, Relatively speaking, it's a coarse adjustment.

PS2s don't deal well with physical abuse, but if left alone and not subjected to dust they last forever, mine is proof.

Yeah, and I have 6 other "proofs" that taking care of the unit still doesn't prevent the DVD drive from going out. I and my friends with PS2 units weren't kids. We were adults that took care of our stuff, not some stupid/careless kids/teenagers. Last I checked, we didn't kick or drop our shit.

If you were really a 1337 HaXOr you would've just replaced the laser and saved yourself $100+

Were did I say I was a "l337 haxor"? Something as simple as adjusting the laser module level/height makes someone a l33t haxor? Wow, standards really have fallen over the years. For all my accomplishments over the years, I'm an elite hacker for that...

I wanted a system with a warranty. I wasn't going to spend ~$100+ on a drive and have something else go wrong. Buying a new system with an extended warranty was worth the additional cost than the headache of dealing with a non guaranteed life span of a repair/drive (plus I would have a newer revision of the console PCB/Drive/etc).

but if you dicked with the height adjustment, it was probably too far gone anyway.

Like I stated, it's a coarse increment system and it's easy to put it back to the original system. And I only "dicked" with the height adjustment after the console was having severe read problems.

[17daysolderthannes]

Where did I say every PS2 in the world has died? Come on, man. There will always be some systems that don't have any symptoms or still run. But they are *not* in the majority from my personal experience. Nor do they seem to be the case nation wide.

Oh really, you know, because I just do console repair at a video game store and have even shady looking PS2s get traded in and work fine all the time. Shit, there was one fat PS2 that had the back of the system's plastic WARPED from heat and it worked with just a simple lense clean, though it was so warped it couldn't spin CD PS2 games fast enough to play them, lol. Personal experience at a video game store>whiny internet retards that lie about their treatment of systems on the internet.

Oh really? Wow, you were there? Right beside me, in my house, the whole time knowing exactly what happened? Fool. Do you what the height adjustment is or how it works? Aren't you "Mr. Console-fix-it-man" by job title? It's a notched spiral/ramp mechanism. Going to far, just drops it back down to the lowest level. One, I marked the original setting and two since it was a notched/lock knob, it's not like you have infinite fine adjustment. Two, Relatively speaking, it's a coarse adjustment.

I want to slap you in the face for this comment. I've fixed more PS2s than you've played on, eat a bowl of STFU. Computer Science (or less) =/= Mechanical Engineering (which is what the laser assembly falls under), sorry bub. The height adjustment wouldn't be off if you didn't physically abuse it, those rails don't wear down under any reasonable amount of use.

Yeah, and I have 6 other "proofs" that taking care of the unit still doesn't prevent the DVD drive from going out. I and my friends with PS2 units weren't kids. We were adults that took care of our stuff, not some stupid/careless kids/teenagers. Last I checked, we didn't kick or drop our shit.

You mean 6 other retards that "thought" they were hot shit and knew what they were doing, those tend to be the people that fuck up their shit the most.

I wanted a system with a warranty. I wasn't going to spend ~$100+ on a drive and have something else go wrong. Buying a new system with an extended warranty was worth the additional cost than the headache of dealing with a non guaranteed life span of a repair/drive (plus I would have a newer revision of the console PCB/Drive/etc).

Wow, did you even really take apart a PS2? They don't even sell complete DVD drives nor do they cost ANYWHERE near $100. New lasers cost $30-$40 max for fats depending on which model you need. The newer revisions of fats were all cost cutting and are much more poorly designed than the earlier ones. The 3000 series is probably the best fat you can buy.

Like I stated, it's a coarse increment system and it's easy to put it back to the original system. And I only "dicked" with the height adjustment after the console was having severe read problems.

You should've, you know, tried cleaning the laser lense. Again, a properly treated system wouldn't need the height adjusted at all.



Every dumbass and dickfart comes into play n trade swearing up and down the take great care of their systems, bullshit. I'll believe it when I see it, and I haven't seen it yet.

[Diosoth]

SONY WAS SUED OVER PS2 DISC READ ERRORS!

It was a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT filed by many, many customers.

Therefore, the PS2, at least early models, deserves the rep as unreliable hardware. I really don't care if I never had a personal failure with a PS2 or if "you never did". When a class action lawsuit is filed due to a defect, then it's a big enough problem.

End of discussion on that.

I think even the PS1 had issues with garbage laser mechanisms that would actually damage themselves over time, when plastic would wear away and throw the tracks off.

Same deal with the 360. It EARNED its rep for RROD thanks to the fact too many of them were doing it.

You got one that still works? Consider yourself lucky but don't cry about it if it eventually happens. Just pray the companies see backwards compatibility as worth implementing into their future consoles... but with the game industry's whole "used games hurt profits" viewpoint, I wouldn't count on it. MS ditched it for a service tomake you re-purchase your Xbox games, Sony can't seem to get it right with the PS3 and Nintendo removed the GBA slot from the DSi... but hey, you can always buy digital versions of those GBA games you already own instead when they expand their online store.

[17daysolderthannes]

SONY WAS SUED OVER PS2 DISC READ ERRORS!

It was a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT filed by many, many customers.

Therefore, the PS2, at least early models, deserves the rep as unreliable hardware. I really don't care if I never had a personal failure with a PS2 or if "you never did". When a class action lawsuit is filed due to a defect, then it's a big enough problem.

End of discussion on that.

No, not end of discussion. First of all, some of that was due to the early models not being compatible with dual layer discs. Second of all:

"While we are convinced that there is no problem with these models, and that we would win if we defended this case through trial, we have agreed to settle these lawsuits to avoid the extraordinary high cost of cumbersome class action litigation,"

In other words: dumbfucks damaged their systems and cried about it. It was in Sony's interest to repair the dumbfucks' systems rather than spend a whole bunch of money alienating customers. Microsoft didn't even get that far, Microsoft just said "oh shit, this hardware sucks, RROD fix for everyone!" Almost every CD/DVD/GD system has been known for disc read errors, only the original Saturn gets a rep for having good reliability, which is probably due to the fact it wasn't around very long and was only used for a short time from very high end consumers (read: affluent adults).

I think even the PS1 had issues with garbage laser mechanisms that would actually damage themselves over time, when plastic would wear away and throw the tracks off.

Same deal with the 360. It EARNED its rep for RROD thanks to the fact too many of them were doing it.

You got one that still works? Consider yourself lucky but don't cry about it if it eventually happens. Just pray the companies see backwards compatibility as worth implementing into their future consoles... but with the game industry's whole "used games hurt profits" viewpoint, I wouldn't count on it. MS ditched it for a service tomake you re-purchase your Xbox games, Sony can't seem to get it right with the PS3 and Nintendo removed the GBA slot from the DSi... but hey, you can always buy digital versions of those GBA games you already own instead when they expand their online store.

The earliest PS1 had a problem because the laser sled was made of plastic instead of ?aluminum? (I don't know what they used instead) and when thrown on a shag carpet or a crammed entertainment center and played for 8 hours straight it would develop read problems. I knew someone that had a SCPH 1001 (the oldest PSX, the one with the read problems) around 2000 or so and played it all the time with no problems. Again, most people abuse their shit and high end video game systems just don't handle abuse and neglect well. Normal CD and DVD players get negative reviews all the time by people that don't take care of them, you just don't hear about it as much because there are so many of them compared to video game systems where there is only 3 or 4 per generation.

[tomaitheous]

I want to slap you in the face for this comment.

You want to slap me? Haha, s-l-a-p me? What are you, some kinda of sissy-ass?

Computer Science (or less) =/= Mechanical Engineering (which is what the laser assembly falls under), sorry bub.

Oh wait, so this is under your jurisdiction? Oh, I'm sorry officer. Do you need to be reminded about falling into this fallacy trap again; attending school/college doesn't mean you actually know your shit. There are plenty of people that have taken courses and even graduated that really don't know shit in their chosen field. Take a few beginner philosophy classes and learn not to fall into such stupid logical fallacy traps, bub.

The height adjustment wouldn't be off if you didn't physically abuse it, those rails don't wear down under any reasonable amount of use.

How can you even know anything about me, let alone my friends? Throwing out blind assumptions just makes you look retarded. The height adjustment wasn't off, genius. Adjusting it was a work around because the laser could not focus adequately on the CD/DVD media. Adjusting the rails to move the laser slightly was to help the laser get a better/working focal length. The drives were dieing, whether it be the laser module or the rail system wearing out. If you weren't such a ass/hot head, then maybe you could have ask me to explain further about something that didn't sound right. Learn some tact.

If the unit HAD been bumped and knocked out of alignment in relation of, then readjustment of the rail height would have fix it, indicating the problem was been "static" and I would have been on my merry way. The fact was that there was wear and was getting worse at an exponential rate. Adjusting the height was a temporary solution. The systems still eventually (with in 1-2 months) died from the original problem. With the cover off, you could see the laser through on top of the disc trying to focus.

You mean 6 other retards that "thought" they were hot shit and knew what they were doing, those tend to be the people that fuck up their shit the most.

Excuse me? Did I say any of them took apart there system or were "hot shit" (not even sure wtf you mean by that)? Do you have reading comprehension problems or something? Or forget to take your ritalin? Where are coming up with these conclusions?

New lasers cost $30-$40 max for fats depending on which model you need.

Yeah, maybe by the time you actually got out of high school and got your Mr. Console-fix-it job. There was no online sites selling replacement the module/assembly for that fucking cheap. That would have been great. Yeah, but again you where right there beside me looking at ALL the sites I was , looking at parts cost.

You should've, you know, tried cleaning the laser lense. Again, a properly treated system wouldn't need the height adjusted at all.

Of all the accomplishments I've made over the years, I clearly lacked the intelligence to have thought of using a lense cleaner. I'm so glad I have you here to inform me of such great advice. Jesus... You're either retarded or just talking shit out your ass because you're butt-hurt (Haha- you want to slap me. Classic).

Every dumbass and dickfart comes into play n trade swearing up and down the take great care of their systems, bullshit. I'll believe it when I see it, and I haven't seen it yet.

Yes, there are a lot of fools out there that don't take care of their shit. But think about it for a second, that's what you're exposed to. But you have no idea what your experience is relative to the whole. You only have but one view/perspective and yet you think it's absolute. And then you make these ignorant assumptions of people who you've never even met (they don't even post in this forum!).

Don't be such a hot head. Did someone piss on your cake or something?

[17daysolderthannes]

Of all the accomplishments I've made over the years, I clearly lacked the intelligence to have thought of using a lense cleaner.

The mere fact that you think a "lense cleaner" that actually works exists as a product is all the proof I need to know you have no idea what you're talking about. Alcohol on a q-tip and canned air duster=the only lense cleaner that works.

[Puffy2k316]

My original launch PS2 lasted until 2008. Since then I've had 2 of them break on me. Both fats.

[gamevet]

I've only had 2 (technically 3) systems die. One was the infamous 360 and the other was my launch Dreamcast.

The Dreamcast died about 2 weeks after my 1 year warranty expired. I traded it in at Walmart and told them it was a gift. My second DC was starting to act up about a year later, before it was stolen from my apartment. My DC systems looked like new, but I believe the marathon internet sessions and PSO took its toll.

I still have my 35001 PS2 (Gran Turismo 3 pack) and it looks like new. I've never put it through rigorous marathon gaming sessions and would usually give it a rest after about 3 hours of play; I've used it as a DVD player maybe 5 or 6 times. I could see why even the best console owners have had problems with the PS2 and it's most likely because they ran it through too many exteded playtimes. I'd say the PS2 is pretty reliable, and it's a lot more reliable than the 4 DVD players I've went though in the same time period. And the PS2 has probably had more hours of playtime than all 4 DVD players.

[17daysolderthannes]

My original launch PS2 lasted until 2008. Since then I've had 2 of them break on me. Both fats.

I take it the 2 others were used? Like I said, the early PS2 fats were great (30001), its the later 50001s that totally suck (and are IMPOSSIBLE to fix thanks to the stupid spring clamps and other retarded assembly cost-cutting changes). The PS2 slim is really the way to go because the whole assembly is much simpler and as we all know simple=reliable as well as the fact that lasers are only $20 and much easier to change. As an added bonus, making a slim PS2 boot-disc (region free/bootleg) compatible is much easier than on a fat.